Join us for an engaging episode of Fearless Females featuring Shannon Marino, an accomplished estate-planning attorney who shares her unique career evolution with host Lorie Jones.
Discover Shannon’s insightful transition from civil litigation to a more fulfilling path in estate law, as she candidly discusses the challenges and rewards of balancing work and family life.
Tune in for a down-to-earth conversation filled with practical advice, personal reflections, and inspiring moments that highlight the power of perseverance and authenticity in the professional world.
Show Highlights:
- Follow the triumphs of a deeper connection with work. [00:04:20]
- Insightful ways to offer modernized estate planning. [00:08:55]
- Why invest in yourself by prioritizing education? [00:13:37]
- Discover the personality secret of the best attorneys. [00:16:01]
- The truth about embracing the maternity challenge. [00:19:03]
- Explore the power of a natural life trajectory. [00:21:46]
- Unlock self-confidence and gratitude-journaling secrets. [00:26:58]
- A then vs. now career landscape of women in law. [00:29:14]
- An empowering dive into motivational motherhood. [00:32:09]
- How to listen to your inner voice for fulfilment. [00:34:40]
If you enjoyed this episode, please go to Apple Podcasts and leave a review! For more information about Lorie Jones, go to http://fearless-females.com/.
00:00.00
loriejones7
Perfect. So. Thank you so much for joining us this morning we are here with Shannon Marino she is an estate planning attorney and I'm super excited I had a chance to just chat with Shannon earlier and I'm really excited for us to learn a little bit more about her. Her journey. Um, and I'll share a secret with you Shannon I actually I always wanted to be a lawyer when I was growing up I had I did a mock trial in like middle school or something like that and I always thought being a lawyer was great and then I um got to college and figured out what.
00:25.47
Shannon J_ Marino
Um, ah.
00:37.76
loriejones7
Like I couldn't keep my eyes open to read the law books. So I have I had the utmost respect for you guys. Could you do such a great job of of ah doing those hard things. So we're going to start out. Thank you so much for joining us I appreciate that.
00:52.95
Shannon J_ Marino
Thank you I'm I'm honored and flattered that you invited me to join you So I'm excited about this.
01:03.40
loriejones7
Ah, so the first question I always ask Shannon is what is your favorite book I am a biblio file I love books I love everything about them. Give me your give me your suggestions.
01:13.84
Shannon J_ Marino
So I'm going to go with a book that is not well known. It is called a land remembered by Patrick Smith I am a huge history person I love all things history. Um I love learning about history reading about history reading about.
01:22.00
loriejones7
Is this.
01:33.32
Shannon J_ Marino
Individuals and what it was like for them to grow up in a totally different era of time. So a land remembered is actually near and dear to my heart. It's written by a Florida author I'm from Florida central Florida area and it's about. A family you follow through several generations of a family and their challenges in raising their kids and making a living and surviving really in the state of Florida in the seventeen hundreds early eighteen hundreds.
02:06.54
loriejones7
That sounds so fascinating. History was my major in college I didn't go back. Get my finance until later. So I'm with you I Love all those stories I love like getting inside their mind and just seeing what they saw so that sounds fascinating and.
02:23.45
Shannon J_ Marino
Um, isn't.
02:24.10
loriejones7
Ah, offline I'll I'll share with you I've got a few suggestions if you haven't read them that are along those lines. So um, so tell us a little bit about yourself. How did you? How did you get where you're at today. Um, what kind of what made you want to.
02:28.80
Shannon J_ Marino
Very cool.
02:40.54
loriejones7
Um, be an estate planning Attorney talk to me about that.
02:42.16
Shannon J_ Marino
Sure so throughout my experience during law school I was so bent on becoming an estate planning attorney I actually interned working with individuals with special needs and. Advocating while I was in law school for disability rights and disability benefits for individuals with special needs I really found a passion in that type of work and so I was absolutely convinced that that's what I was going to do um. So much so that I did not do mock trial like you because I thought oh I'm absolutely not going to need that well when you get out of law school I actually had my first child. So my first daughter about three months after I graduated law school and.
03:31.97
loriejones7
Oh wow.
03:35.82
Shannon J_ Marino
It was time to make a living and it was time to you know, pay those student loans and put my degree to work so I actually went into civil litigation and did all of the things that I convinced myself I would never do which was due depositions. Be in court be in a very adverse sarial type situation and I found actually that I really loved it and I had a real passion for it and I did that for roughly eight years here in the in the Denver Colorado area. Um.
04:02.36
loriejones7
Um, times.
04:12.47
Shannon J_ Marino
Absolutely loved everything about it. It was exciting. It was exhilarating. It was all the things that you see on Tv and then some um, but throughout my tenure as that civil litigation attorney I also had 2 more children and was feeling that poll. Of really wanting to open up my degree do more with my degree have a better connection with my clients on a different level and also really have a better connection with myself. Um.
04:48.58
Shannon J_ Marino
A lot of people don't realize that as attorneys many times we really have to turn off emotions in order to handle certain cases and you know tragic situations and that's turning off the emotions and really turning off your own opinions. Um comes at a price. And that you start to really kind of disconnect yourself from your work and when you are working very very long hours. Six days a week that disconnection from yourself really can be calm a disconnection from the world around you. Um, and so.
05:08.42
loriejones7
He.
05:22.16
loriejones7
Um.
05:24.78
Shannon J_ Marino
When Covid hit I Really knew that I was ready for that next phase in my career I was really ready for an opportunity to show up for my clients in a totally different way and so I did tap back into that um, estate planning kind of disabilities planning.
05:43.95
Shannon J_ Marino
Approach many of the cases that I had worked during my civil litigation ah time were made much much worse by lack of a state planning and so I took some of those lessons that I saw and that I learned through those really tragic situations and. Decided that I wanted to do something different and really chart my own path as it relates to my legal career. The legal industry estate planning in general. Um and really kind of do my part to bring. Legal industry into the 2020 s and no longer have the typical relationships that most attorneys have with their clients as we've seen over the past generations handling of the the legal industry.
06:23.80
loriejones7
Um.
06:34.19
loriejones7
Oh that's interesting. So so did you know from like age 5 that you wanted to be a lawyer when you got to college is that what you wanted to do or.
06:47.23
Shannon J_ Marino
I did actually ah 3 of my parents. So my stepmother my stepfather and my father are all attorneys. So I say that I absolutely had to go to law school otherwise I would never win an argument in my own household. So um.
06:55.42
loriejones7
Ah.
07:03.46
Shannon J_ Marino
It was absolutely something I wanted to do um I did get delayed you know and and kind of had my doubts So when I first went for my undergrad kind of thought maybe this is not right for me similar to what your thoughts were and but then I went in I got my master's in business and one of the professors just randomly.
07:14.35
loriejones7
Who.
07:23.26
Shannon J_ Marino
Said to me, you know you really need to go to law school and I had actually many several professors over my University stay that that had said that to me and I thought okay maybe they see something that and I should really pursue this and. Finally buckle down and get through those law school textbooks.
07:43.43
loriejones7
Ah, so what? and the other thing you mentioned is that you were interested in kind of changing the way that traditional estate law was done like what sort of things were you seeing that you want to have an impact on or maybe change.
07:57.70
Shannon J_ Marino
Yeah, So what? I commonly saw was that historically estate planning is really viewed as planning for death and planning who gets what when we pass away but the reality is is that. We've gone through a lot of changes in society number 1 Medicine has changed um and we have incredible medical professionals and research facilities here in the Us and worldwide that have done a great job of extending out our lifespans. Um, but haven't necessarily extended out the quality of life so we are seeing incapacity planning that needs to be um, the top priority for most of us when when it comes to a state planning and so more modern approach to estate planning is is.
08:34.73
loriejones7
Um.
08:54.26
Shannon J_ Marino
Planning for your life as well as the lives of your loved ones when you are with us. But maybe you are incapacitated meaning you can't manage your own decisions make your own decisions and planning for the lives of your loved ones after you've passed away and what does that look like.
09:06.10
loriejones7
Who.
09:13.63
Shannon J_ Marino
How do you make that happen from a financial standpoint but also from you know a passing on of life lessons and values and care and love for those loved ones which is why actually your profession is is so integral and and essential in what I do.
09:21.64
loriejones7
Okay.
09:33.80
Shannon J_ Marino
Because we always want to make sure that they are My clients are really protected from a financial standpoint through all stages of life. Not just a passing on of the assets.
09:40.81
loriejones7
Is.
09:47.44
loriejones7
Yeah I'm I'm glad you mentioned that because that really is there is a give and take between our professions because I'm so concerned making sure that our clients are financially secure. But we're running into that same issue where they are maybe not mentally. Um. You know they're all. They're not all there. They're incapacitated or or they're having some problems and I don't want to see them getting taken advantage of or having you know anything that they ah and even when you get back to you know, having dealt with it with my grandparents when you get back to that end of life decisions like. How do you make decisions for your grandparents and especially if they haven't really told you what they think or or what they feel and you always think oh I've talked to Grandma and grandpa I know everything about them when it comes to making those really hard decisions end of life. You haven't talked about that most of the time.
10:41.91
Shannon J_ Marino
Yeah, yeah, I'll tell you the second way that I've really approached a state planning in a more modern way is is you know with our grandparents our parents our grandparents our great grandparents a lot of times we all lived in the same town right? like.
10:43.66
loriejones7
So I.
10:59.85
loriejones7
Um.
11:00.20
Shannon J_ Marino
It was multi-generational. You didn't leave your town y'all banked at you know the bank that sat at the corner of first and Maine everybody knew everybody's business and so there wasn't really this as as transient of a society. So another thing that I would I would frequently see is that. Family members would step in for the incapacitated individual or maybe for the the grandmother that's passed and they have no idea where their assets are they have no idea where they bank or you know who holds the the loan on their car and things of that nature. So. Again, like doing a complete inventory of the portfolio so that the family members know exactly what they have can locate what they have and we're ensuring that that portfolio is being monitored to cover the debts.
11:56.80
loriejones7
Um, yeah.
11:57.92
Shannon J_ Marino
To make sure that if there are minor children left behind that those minor children are being cared for and being and being paid for and being financially supported in ways that the family really needs. So. It's really It's really an interesting time to be in the legal industry. We've just seen so many changes in our society as as from from it as it relates to how we live but also from Washington Dc I'm sure you know this, we've had more regulation changes in tax changes over the last. 15 years than we had over the prior 50 and so you know really having a team of trusted advisors that are watching over a family's position whether it's you know their assets or their medical needs or what have you. I find that to be really integral and and no longer should it be strictly something for the ultra wealthy this really needs to be for every family every the everyday family so that they're being protected. Their assets are protect protect. Protected and their loved ones are protected.
13:06.20
loriejones7
Yeah, absolutely we share a passion there. So I I appreciate that so Shannon what is if you could go back and look at it. What is the best investment you made in yourself.
13:11.80
Shannon J_ Marino
Um, yeah.
13:20.98
loriejones7
Um, if you could say 1 thing. Oh I am so glad I really did that because it made a huge difference in where I am today. What would that be.
13:27.90
Shannon J_ Marino
So this is a very unpopular answer. But I'm going to tell you my education I always bet on myself and whether that is taking that job with the firm that I'm not sure about I'm not sure where it's going to go or it is.
13:37.87
loriejones7
Um.
13:46.68
Shannon J_ Marino
Going to the night school and putting myself through you know business school at night or taking a chance on myself and putting myself through law school I Really find that the best investments are in yourself and taking that risk. Um, because if it is something that you are truly passionate about you're going to make it Work. You're going to make it Happen. You're going to be successful and you really control your destiny and what happens and so I tell people all the time. Just do it. Invest in yourself and if if it means going to nursing school even late 30 s just do it because you're gonna make it work and you're gonna figure out a way you're gonna figure out a path to be successful.
14:36.54
loriejones7
I think that's super interesting. My sister one time I was um I was saying something about I I needed to go back and get some more education but I had young children and I'm like I just don't know if I can do it and and. But I still need it and she's like gloie if you had done it a year ago when you talked to me, you would already be finished with this by now and I thought about it I'm like I'm going to be 30 I'm going to be 35 anyway I might as well have the you know the credentials or the education or the training or the experience. And and still be at that age I love that idea you now you went to you went to regular college a master's in business and then law school too.
15:18.70
Shannon J_ Marino
Yes, yeah, and I don't regret any of it and I know it can be expensive. There's gonna be people that are watching this that say Shannon that's not realistic for every person and I totally understand that. Um, but I also. Um, a firm believer and if this is truly what you want to do? You're not him and in Haton this isn't a default because somebody told you to do it and you can't figure out what else to do this is something that you really want to do do not waste time and jump in and do it and.
15:38.21
loriejones7
Here.
15:53.31
Shannon J_ Marino
Have confidence in yourself. Um.
15:55.32
loriejones7
Yeah, ah, fearless right? Fearless. So What is have you ever gotten Really bad advice like the worst advice ever given and did you take it. Or did you not? How did you learn something from it. How'd that work.
16:12.41
Shannon J_ Marino
So I'm an attorney and there's lots of personalities and and lots of ways that you can use your ball practice your law degree and practice law and I've seen skilled attorneys on. All ends of the spectrum as it relates to super aggressive attorneys kind and compassionate attorneys you know I think the ones that make it on Tv are kind of you know the ones that are made for Tv um, and I'll tell you that I've been trained by. Of a variety of attorneys the attorneys that I found and the individuals in my profession that I found to be the most successful are the ones that have confidence in themselves confidence in their skills. But do not have to be the loudest in the room. Um I think that there is something to be said for quiet Confidence. Um, and those individuals that are able to really quietly take in what's going on around them quietly observe. What's happening and able to connect with the people in the room on a more authentic level are the ones that are going to be the most successful. Um I am embarrassed to say I haven't always behaved that way.
17:41.24
loriejones7
Um.
17:47.96
Shannon J_ Marino
And that is part of my path and my journey in my law practice and while I've kind of taken on the demeanor of several different types of of attorneys. The one that the the cases that I've I've been happiest with and the clients that I've connected the best with was when I was able to have more of that authentic connection with them rather than um. Perhaps the show voting that sometimes comes along in the and the legal industry.
18:21.20
loriejones7
Yeah, the look at me look at me So the so the worst advice would be the you have to be the the but the shiniest thing in the room in order to make it work. Yeah yeah.
18:34.21
Shannon J_ Marino
Exactly exactly.
18:39.70
loriejones7
Ah, well, that's good news for me because I'm quiet most of the times. Ah so um, if you look back I know that you know there's regrets. We all have regrets. We all look at a situation and said oh goodness I wish I would have done that differently or.
18:46.22
Shannon J_ Marino
Um.
18:56.11
loriejones7
Um, and and you do learn something from every experience but is there an experience you can look back on and knowing what you know now if you could go back and do it. You would do it differently.
19:07.56
Shannon J_ Marino
I would have started my own firm roughly 5 years prior than when I actually started it so I'm about just shy of 3 years into my own law practice. Um.
19:15.42
loriejones7
Ah.
19:21.75
Shannon J_ Marino
And I I have regrets that I I doubted myself and and delayed and going and writing my own path and and starting my own firm.
19:33.70
loriejones7
You said you really enjoyed um being the litigation Attorney and that's what that's what you know you you were enjoying that piece. Oops.
19:47.26
loriejones7
Sorry it it. There was some sort of a glitch So We'll start Again. So um, you said that you really enjoyed being a litigation attorney and you enjoyed that you know that peace and being in court was the fact that you were still enjoying it was that holding you back or you were just. You were scared of taking that next step.
20:12.39
loriejones7
Are you still there Shannon can you hear me? um.
20:21.67
loriejones7
Okay.
21:26.82
loriejones7
I can see you now. Can you hear me sorry about that. So well this is the sort of thing they can edit out so don't worry about it. But so Shannon you said that you really enjoyed that litigation piece.
21:32.51
Shannon J_ Marino
Um, there you go? yes.
21:41.29
Shannon J_ Marino
Um, twice.
21:43.99
loriejones7
And and being in court and and all the challenges that that came with is that you were enjoying it so much that you didn't want to move on or you were so you know worried about changing direction like why.
22:02.94
Shannon J_ Marino
I Think a little bit of both a little bit of both I I really enjoyed it but I could also see that it really had a time limit and that um it was not going to be something that I wanted to do forever. Um, it definitely.
22:06.77
loriejones7
Okay.
22:18.39
loriejones7
It has.
22:19.91
Shannon J_ Marino
Um, took me away from my children because that's that's a huge time commitment in order to really advocate adequately for for your clients. Um, and so while on a person on a professional level I I really enjoyed the work. I knew that it was not going to be my final chapter for my career and so um I certainly delayed until I kind of had an idea as to what my next path looked like um and you know I think that was also a little bit out of fear. Right? as a mother and you got 3 kids and and you you want to do right and you want to make the right choice from a professional standpoint but also from ah from a family standpoint. Um, so I do I do think that I delayed a few years
23:17.72
Shannon J_ Marino
Just out of can I Really do this and is this the right path.
23:20.28
loriejones7
Um, yeah, that's it's interesting how we sometimes it's hard to see the answer sometimes um, you know and and looking back with the experience that you have now. Yeah, it's Gone. You know it's gone really well and and you wish that you had done it a little bit sooner. Um, but but you didn't have that experience when you made the decision.
23:47.50
Shannon J_ Marino
Right? And you know I think Covid Shook a lot of people. It gave us a lot of perspective. There were a lot of challenges that we all faced through the Covid period and you know if anything it. It showed me that we are all very resilient.
23:49.23
loriejones7
Here.
24:07.40
Shannon J_ Marino
And that if we have to make something work. We can right like I can be on a Zoom hearing while also have my children six feet away so I can you know teach them while they're in their online class or what have you. Um, and I I think that was kind of a wake up call of like it's never going to be a perfect time. The the circumstances are never going to perfectly align I hear this all the time for my clients of like we want to have children but we're waiting for the perfect time. And I say it's never going to be perfect. So you know through covid that really opened my eyes ah a lot more of you know we are resilient people we are um if as long as we we have faith in ourself and believe in o ourselves. We can be successful and. Moms are just I believe that they're on another level and they're the the perfect figure it outers and you know I really leaned on that resilience out of the covid era to help. Bring me that clarity that I was looking for.
25:17.43
loriejones7
Yeah, cool I like that. So if you could go back and talk to your younger self your 20 your 21 year old self. Um, what would you tell her.
25:30.56
Shannon J_ Marino
I Would tell believe it or not I would tell my younger self to just relax I think that there's a lot of pressure on young people to know exactly to have all the answers and.
25:42.74
loriejones7
Oh gosh.
25:50.37
Shannon J_ Marino
Um, are you So with me.
25:51.66
loriejones7
Um, it came back on I Yeah I don't know it's it's it's glitching. Maybe there's a issue with internet but um so you would tell yourself to relax. Can you hear me? Oh no.
26:40.16
loriejones7
Um, Shannon I'm so sorry I think there's ah that's all right? So all right? You would tell yourself to relax. So.
26:43.00
Shannon J_ Marino
I Yeah I think that was me that time I think my internet dropped for just a second. So I apologize for that. Yeah I mean I think our generation especially being raised in the south. It was. It was very much a generation of figured out. What are you gonna do? What are you gonna go to school for.. What do you want to be when you grow up that was the question right? What do you want to be when you grow up and I think what happens is is that in that stress and in that pressure to figure it out and make the right choice because this is going to be a forever choice.
27:24.49
loriejones7
Is.
27:28.94
Shannon J_ Marino
Um, that my generation somewhat made decisions based on that pressure and rather than what their passion was um and so I I would have probably told myself just relax like it's going to be fine. You're going to figure it out.
27:35.13
loriejones7
Is this. She.
27:47.48
Shannon J_ Marino
When is the right time to get married. You'll figure it out when is the right time to have children. You'll figure it out career. You know if you're in it for 15 years and you decide you don't like it switch life is long and it is ah while it's long. It's too short.
27:48.39
loriejones7
Um.
28:04.34
Shannon J_ Marino
To be doing something that doesn't drive you that doesn't give you passion. Um, and so nowadays when I'm working with families that have younger kids I usually say don't ask them what they want to be ask them? What do they see their future as is it living in the city. Is it living.
28:04.92
loriejones7
Um, yeah.
28:23.49
loriejones7
This is.
28:23.68
Shannon J_ Marino
Out in the country. What kind of quality of life. Do you want what kind of lifestyle and then you figure out Really how to make that happen and um, what career path to to choose.
28:29.70
loriejones7
Yeah I love that we we get the same problem when we say what you know? What do you want to do during retirement. It's it's that same sort of question. What do you want to be when you grew up and it's it's a hard answer. You know you have to. What what do you see yourself doing or how does your life look or who do you see yourself surrounded with like that kind of that gives you a little bit more clarity for what what you want? How? Um, how old are your kids Shannon.
28:58.44
Shannon J_ Marino
I have a 12 year old daughter and then I have 2 boys that are 9 and 7 so we are very active right now.
29:07.90
loriejones7
Right in the thick of things. Absolutely I was just I I have um teenagers on the older end and young adults and it seems like that pressure to what do you want to be or what do you want to do has turned has really.
29:23.52
loriejones7
Been Amplified. It feels like even in this generation because it's not.. It's it's more along the lines if you don't play soccer and you're in the ah you know the national honor society and you take. Meals to the poor and you go to an Ivy league school then you're not going to be successful and there's there's a lot of pressure put on that age group. Still I think.
29:52.73
Shannon J_ Marino
Yeah, and it's unfortunate. Um, you know I think as we walk through Life. We're all going to wear different hats. We're all going to walk different paths and sometimes you're going to you know make a left or a right. And I think the old way of thinking was you better. Make sure that that turn is right is the correct turn to make for you? Um I think I'm hoping that with the future generations we're making them. Into more resilient and more adaptable individuals more well-rounded individuals so that you know what if you made a right right hand turn and it was a mistake they have the confidence and the knowledge and the resilience to write the correction. Um, before it's too late before they have too many regrets. Um and before they're really living a life that doesn't drive them and give them the passion that they're that they deserve that we all deserve.
30:46.81
loriejones7
Yeah I like that So what scared you the most when you started out and does it still scare you.
31:02.70
Shannon J_ Marino
I you know everything is everything is scary I think the first time that you're doing it. You know my first job as ah as a ah little baby attorney that was absolutely scary and intimidating can I do this.
31:20.32
Shannon J_ Marino
Um, certainly starting my own law firm was a huge risk and but again I just have the utmost confidence in myself and confidence in my loved ones really surrounding me and and ensuring that I feel their support and their love.
31:39.45
Shannon J_ Marino
Um, but everything is scary, especially you know from anything from you know am I making the right decision for my kid in his school and is this the right teacher to you know, um, should I walk into this big. Meeting and and what is this going to be like and how am I going to show up in a way that is helpful and in ah of service I don't know that those feelings ever really go away and I don't know that I really want them to go Away. You know a certain level of of. Discomfort tells me that I'm pushing myself that I'm growing and then I'm really challenging myself and so I'm learning to be okay with the the feeling of of being afraid and being scared.
32:31.44
loriejones7
It's so interesting. 1 of the women I was just talking to was talking about a book that talked about you take fear along but you make it sit in the backseat. There are like roles. But.
32:41.49
Shannon J_ Marino
Um, yeah, exactly exactly.
32:43.96
loriejones7
So I find that so interesting. So how did you is there a ah way that you developed that kind of confidence in yourself. Did it just come from trying the situations or or how did that How did that self confidence. How do you grow that.
33:01.21
Shannon J_ Marino
Um, how did that self-confidence come to be. You know I think it's just over time. Um I have a business coach that that is constantly telling me to celebrate the small wins. You know we oftentimes look at the big wins. Did we get the big job.
33:06.34
loriejones7
Um.
33:18.63
Shannon J_ Marino
Did we get the big raise Did we get the big promotion but she's constantly telling me that if you're not paying attention. You're gonna you're gonna overlook the glimmers in your day right? You got the good parking spot. You um you know your cup of coffee was just.
33:29.11
loriejones7
Um.
33:37.00
Shannon J_ Marino
Really really good that day and in looking for those small wins throughout the day and looking for those small wins over my life. It really does build a. Another level of not just gratitude and appreciation. But also another level of confidence like look at what I did with that situation or look at what I did with that client and it may just be a blimp on my client's radar or may just be a blimp on my kid's day. Um, but. If you aren't Careful. You're going to miss all of that and we're not really living in a society that's going to remind you so you really have to take those moments for yourself and when you start to collect all of those little blimmers. It starts to make you realize just how fortunate and how amazing you are um and how amazing the life that you are building is and again gives you that that gratitude of the appreciation. But also that confidence.
34:39.57
loriejones7
I Love that I like that idea of kind of taking and and noticing when you've done something well or when you've had a win and and maybe even tracking that you know so that you can go back in those times when you're discouraged and you don't think anything's going right? and your children are telling you you're awful just breathe.
34:52.71
Shannon J_ Marino
Happens.
34:59.40
loriejones7
Maybe through some of those great things that you do.
35:04.14
Shannon J_ Marino
Um, ah, hundred percent so one of my business coaches put me onto a gratitude journal and every every day I have to list 3 things that that happen that were that were good. Um, that day and it could be a big win or it could be like I said a small win where you get a good parking spot on a really snowy day and that is absolutely helpful to put things into perspective.
35:23.60
loriejones7
I Love that Just love that idea. So what about challenges uniquely to you because you were a woman did you run into any of that in your career.
35:39.25
Shannon J_ Marino
100 % 100% when you asked me, you know about something that I was regretful of and and kind of the the rules that I took on as an attorney most of that was really dictated because the legal industry. Um. Especially when I was a baby attorney is predominantly male and so in order to get a seat at the table. You really had to take on that male persona and prove yourself to be of somewhat equal. Level in order to get a seat at the table. Um, so while I was regretful in kind of taking on the male persona and and in in order to get to the table I was also so very very mindful that once I was at that table I still had my boundaries right. I had enough confidence in enough position and enough of a voice at that point to say no you know it's time for me to go home and have dinner with my kids. Um and so being a female in the legal industry has been incredibly difficult. I'm very much aware that I was passed over for promotions I'm very much aware that I did not have equal pay. There's a there's a little bit and I'm sad to say there's a little bit of you have to be okay with it. This is how it is um and.
37:09.45
Shannon J_ Marino
To some degree I think you you need to be accepting of it in order to make those changes in order to make your way into the club and then start to right? Those wrongs for the women that follow.
37:23.63
loriejones7
Oh yeah, that's so interesting because we do all. Ah you know, lean on the examples and the the um the ways that women before us have made changes in in our different industries and.
37:27.27
Shannon J_ Marino
Always.
37:37.88
loriejones7
Making it a little bit better for those that come after us. So do you see? did you see that changing at all through the years that you've been in.
37:48.84
Shannon J_ Marino
Absolutely absolutely when I first started ah as a baby attorney I want to say there were only a handful of female attorneys um, and then with the firm that I was at and then you know over time the females really rose to the top. And by the time I left it was you know the females were really kind of running the show. Um I believe the statistic is somewhere around 60% to 70% of law school students are female now. Um.
38:16.85
loriejones7
Wow.
38:22.20
Shannon J_ Marino
Ah, believe that's the last statistic that I saw so we're making progress we're making progress that's for sure.
38:26.24
loriejones7
Do you know? do you have any idea and I can look this up but do you have any idea how many what percentage of of Attorneys or women.
38:39.57
Shannon J_ Marino
I Don't at this point in time you know, sad to say a lot of them actually do have to take a step back from the profession in order to raise children and and things of that nature. Um, but I'm I'm not aware of the current statistics.
38:45.23
loriejones7
Um, okay.
38:50.91
loriejones7
That's so interesting and that and that that actually follows our industry as well where we have um, you know we we get women into finance but they can't stay because they they have caretaking responsibilities be it children or. Or parents or something like that. In fact, it happens through a lot of different industries. So that's ah that's interesting so what Shannon are you the most proud of what.
39:18.90
Shannon J_ Marino
Oh I am the most proud of being a mother. Are you kidding me? they are the greatest accomplishment I measure being a mother to just about anything and I had to go in for surgery and the surgeons kept saying you know how are you feeling I said I've birth 3 kids I've got this. Like are you kidding me like this is nothing um they are absolutely my pride and joy they're absolutely my driving force and they're actually a driving force for me with my connection with my clients and a constant reminder of again.
39:54.18
Shannon J_ Marino
How are you going to financially care for yourself through different stages of life but also any kiddos that are in the household aging parents that are relying upon you um, constantly constantly a reminder of what I do why I do it. And why I'm really also so passionate about kind of riding my own path in the legal industry and and and making those changes. Well even if they're baby steps. Um, so that my daughter has perhaps a little bit of a better world to be to be In. Um.
40:29.50
Shannon J_ Marino
And and I do feel like progress is being made but it we've still got a long way to go.
40:31.64
loriejones7
Yeah, and I think that's true everywhere. But I love that the idea of of doing things for you know because you know your daughter's coming up you know and I've got sons too. So Obviously we you know we're we're gender neutral there. But. But I do think that it's important for girls to see that you can do things that you can be successful and you can be a successful mother as well and I think that's an important example to give to our kids.
40:48.60
Shannon J_ Marino
Nice.
41:02.61
Shannon J_ Marino
Yeah, and I'm glad you brought up your boys because that you know is another thing that I I really focus on is yes I want to instill a level of confidence and ability in my daughter but I also want my sons to see that. Their wives their future wives or their future daughters. Um, really should be given equal opportunities and equal equal respect. Um and and trying to to eliminate those gender rules as it relates to my boys.
41:26.10
loriejones7
And.
41:35.45
loriejones7
Yeah I love that and as moms we have a big um we have a big impact on that you know how we raise our sons and and as wives how our husbands deal with those situations too. So I think that's that's an interesting point to bring up. So.
41:52.62
loriejones7
Well, any advice if you could talk to a young lady who's maybe just starting down this path that you have been navigating so successfully any advice for her to help her be where you are to be successful like you.
42:12.31
Shannon J_ Marino
I would advise her to listen to her inner voice 9 times out of 10 our inner voice is going to steer us in the right direction and whether that is choosing a partner whether that is. Having a child whether that is going to school whether that is taking a job. Um, really listening to the inner voice and shutting out the external noise that can be caused by society I think is essential. Um. And and making sure that they're able to write that path and kind of follow their own journey um is ah what I find to be crucial, especially for the later years because it usually does lead to financial independence.
43:01.98
Shannon J_ Marino
It usually does lead to more confidence and more happiness and the professional lives as well as their personal personal lives and the thing that makes me the saddest is when I have somebody that I'm working with it's the end of their life. And I believe the statistic is around 75% of the time they usually say to me that their biggest regret is that they did not live life to their fullest that they did not live up to their full capabilities whether that be in their home at work. And their personal relationships and I find it to be the saddest because at that point it's too late to really write those paths and to do anything about it. Um, so I would tell a young individual.
43:53.43
loriejones7
Um.
44:00.50
Shannon J_ Marino
Male or female listen to that inner voice and really do what that inner voice is is driving you to do.
44:06.85
loriejones7
So that when you get to the end. You don't have those regrets that you're looking back on Gosh I wish I had right? I Love Yeah yeah I agree it's a little bit of um, you know.
44:17.70
Shannon J_ Marino
Um, absolutely.
44:21.74
loriejones7
Podcast is named fearless females and it's a little bit fearless isn't like you know, just doing anything because you're not scared it. It kind of boils down to you might be a little scared. Do it anyway. Yeah.
44:38.13
Shannon J_ Marino
Um, yes, absolutely absolutely.
44:40.20
loriejones7
Thank you Shannon so much for spending some time with us today and I appreciate you sharing your journey and your your experience if we have if listeners have questions where do they find you at.
44:53.90
Shannon J_ Marino
Yeah, so you can go to my website wwwww dot s j marino lot dot com and that'll take you to some contact forms. You can send me a message. You can also jump on my calendar.
45:04.48
loriejones7
Perfect. Well thank you I Appreciate your time all right I'm going to push stop for.
45:10.16
Shannon J_ Marino
Thank you! This was awesome I had so much fun.