In this episode, host Lorie Jones sits down with Candice Mitchell, CEO of The Talent Collective and creator of the Talent Development Academy, for an honest conversation about building human-centered leadership and speaking up for your own achievements.
Candice Mitchell recounts her inspiring path from aspiring teacher to business leader to build a meaningful career around her passion for developing people, sharing candid lessons about finding your voice, making authentic business decisions, and navigating setbacks. She discusses overcoming imposter syndrome, building meaningful networks, and the subtle barriers women face as they strive for leadership roles.
Get ready for practical strategies, a dose of courage, and the motivation to say yes more often and claim more space in the workplace. This episode offers a wealth of real-world advice to help you step confidently into your next big move!
Show Highlights:
- Shaping a pivotal career through honest, non-linear thinking. [07:10]
- Expanding learning and development professionals’ impact. [11:13]
- Get out of your own way with business and mindset coaching. [14:00]
- Why women must say yes to opportunities and visibility more. [16:09]
- Growth hacks vs. authentic, no-B.S. social media marketing. [18:30]
- How not networking deliberately will cost you promotions. [24:38]
- How to share achievements without bragging. [28:48]
- Financial wisdom on saving and grounded upgrading. [31:53]
- Why do top-level women struggle to find work? [37:36]
- Advice to “choose you” and not dilute your identity and role. [45:03]
Learn more about the Talent Collective at https://talentcollective.org/about
If you enjoyed this episode, please go to Apple Podcasts and leave a review!
For more information about Lorie Jones, go to https://fearlessfinancialadvisors.com/fearless-females.
00:01.91
Lorie Jones
Good morning, Fearless Females. So today we have Candice Mitchell, and she is the CEO of the Talent Collective. I’m so excited to get to chat with you today, Candice. We’ve chatted on your podcast, and so this is kind of a ah round two, I love our conversation, and so I’m really excited to have you share your insights with with my guests. Thank you so much.
00:25.21
Candice Mitchell
Yeah, yeah. Thanks for having me. It was great chatting with you. So hopefully, you know, we can add as much value to your listeners.
00:33.21
Lorie Jones
So my very first question is always, and I honestly thought about that this this you know like this morning, I’m like, mine my pile of books is so big. like to Do I keep asking the question? But I do. i love reading. Tell me what your favorite book is.
00:50.46
Candice Mitchell
Yeah, um and if I can do two, because there’s a business book that I love, and then there’s also just a book that I read that has just recently stuck with me. The story, the characters just really stuck with me. So the first book that I would recommend is actually called The Heart of Business. um for a new era of capitalism by Hubert Jolie and he was the CEO of Best Buy and when he ended that career he wrote the book and i remember reading it. It wasn’t something that I chose deliberately or anything like that. i was literally studying my masters which I only studied two years ago and I qualified when I was 40.
01:34.78
Candice Mitchell
um And the title just hit me. I didn’t know who he was. I didn’t even really know about Best Buy, you know, because I’m new to America. And i was like, let me read this book. And it is just one of those that I literally, I studied, i studied more. I did so much research into it, so many presentations on it. And I just loved it. I just thought, what if leaders led like this?
02:01.21
Candice Mitchell
it would just be a different corporate world. And so I love that. And then the other one is just, I can’t even remember the title, but it’s something like the words we cannot say.
02:05.74
Lorie Jones
No.
02:12.33
Candice Mitchell
And that was just a story that I read, but you know, like a novel, because I try and read one business book and one non-business book. I alternate. So I love that.
02:22.90
Candice Mitchell
That is just one of those that made me cry. And like the characters, you feel like you know them you’re how are they doing? yeah, those are the two books.
02:32.25
Lorie Jones
all is it do you remember the author who wrote it? That sounds really great.
02:36.47
Candice Mitchell
Yeah, I can definitely quickly look it up because it will be in my Audible. So i’ll I’ll look it up and we can even pop it in the description.
02:42.17
Lorie Jones
and student if get off That’s great.
02:44.42
Candice Mitchell
Yeah.
02:45.27
Lorie Jones
yeah i
02:45.93
Candice Mitchell
I’m bad at remembering authors, which isn’t good because going to be an author.
02:47.96
Lorie Jones
I know. And I ah delve in yet into business books and and I leave that um that storytelling world. And I think that kind of ah hits your creative brain and helps you to kind of think outside the box and think a little bit more broadly.
03:03.64
Candice Mitchell
Yes.
03:05.22
Lorie Jones
So I love i love that when I get suggestions for both, that sounds really neat.
03:10.47
Candice Mitchell
Yes. Okay, here it is. The Things We Cannot Say, and it’s by Kelly Rimmer. New York Times bestselling.
03:16.44
Lorie Jones
Okay.
03:17.95
Candice Mitchell
Oh, it was, yeah, still think about the characters.
03:22.18
Lorie Jones
That’s great. That’s great. I love that. I love that when a book like touches your life in that way and it kind of sticks around. So, yeah. um Tell me a little bit about your journey.
03:34.37
Lorie Jones
Candice, tell me about how you got started. Like, did you know what you were going to be when you were really young? how did you how did your career kind of unfold? Was it a straight line or sort of a circle?
03:44.66
Lorie Jones
and And where are you at?
03:45.50
Candice Mitchell
Yeah.
03:46.50
Lorie Jones
What are you doing today?
03:47.99
Candice Mitchell
Yes, I mean, it’s a little bit of both of those things. So when I was young, I actually did want to be a teacher. um I loved my teachers, you know, and I also had really bad teachers. as well. So when I had a good teacher, I was like, whoa, this is this is what this is, you know, like to have someone guide you and be that person. I remember as my grade two teacher, that was Mrs. Paken, that, you know, was like still the most memorable teacher that I’ve had in my, in my journey. But then when i was, you know, in high school, or
04:25.27
Candice Mitchell
Sorry, my dog can open the door, always gives me a fright. um ah So when I was in high school and we started doing the research of what we want to be, I realized teachers don’t get paid anything. And I was like, okay, no, this is not for me. It’s, you know, it was the dream. And i took a couple of gap years. I moved to London, did some odds and end jobs.
04:48.92
Candice Mitchell
And I came back and I realized, OK, I want to work with people. That is that is the common thread. And so I studied organizational psychology. And in my fourth year, so South Africa works a little bit differently to the US.
05:01.09
Candice Mitchell
You actually do years together. you study with the same group throughout. And a fourth year is in between a degree and a master’s, and uniquely South African.
05:10.53
Lorie Jones
Mm-hmm.
05:12.06
Candice Mitchell
i think there’s like some European countries that do it, but it’s called an honors degree. So during this honors degree, In came a person that told us what she did, and it was in learning and development. And I was sitting there thinking,
05:25.21
Candice Mitchell
that is this a job like people get paid to do this this sounds amazing and i was sold ever since so that one guest lecturer to this day i wish i could remember her name because i would email her like you she literally changed the course of my life in that little you know probably 20 minute chat um and so i chose it i started off as a learning and development administrator within the 10 years at a corporate, I became a director, it was called the learning and development process optimization lead.
06:01.75
Candice Mitchell
Sounds fancy, but basically I got to look at the whole learning and development infrastructure and ecosystem and see what’s modern, how can we make this better? It was just awesome.
06:14.42
Candice Mitchell
Then I had my kids. I moved into consulting. And I say consulting like that because i was earning like equivalent of $100 a month when I started. um i was pregnant with my second child. It was like all the things, right? And I write about this in my book as well. So yeah, just having that sort of play play business of Like, you’re not really, but I’d wanted to do because I love my work so much. So I pushed and eventually I did. I actually doubled my corporate salary in 18 months. So that was pretty cool.
06:48.04
Lorie Jones
That is, that’s a big lift.
06:50.65
Candice Mitchell
But yeah, it was, it was, um and, and had a baby in those 18 months. So it was, it was a thing.
06:58.16
Lorie Jones
Yeah.
06:59.49
Candice Mitchell
um But I think I just genuinely love what I do. so believe I’m good at it because I’m so interested in it. I just want to learn more about it and, I improve probably every single day of my career. I’m like, oh, we could do this better. We could do that better. You know, i’ve never I’m never done.
07:17.14
Candice Mitchell
And it’s ah it’s a gift to be here, honestly. It ah truly is a gift to enjoy something so much. I wish that for everybody.
07:27.44
Candice Mitchell
And then, so we moved to America, did some corporate American stuff, and now I’m back consulting.
07:27.84
Lorie Jones
Yeah.
07:32.80
Candice Mitchell
So you asked me where I am now. I’m the CEO of the Talent Collective. I call myself a CEO and a creator because i also created the Talent Development Academy, which is a membership for learning and development professionals.
07:46.47
Lorie Jones
Oh, that’s cool. So, so do you work on like the corporate side where you kind of teach the employees, you develop that sort of talent or are you more like coaching?
07:56.94
Lorie Jones
I don’t like, or do you do all of it?
07:58.07
Candice Mitchell
in Yeah, thanks for asking that. So yes, I and I can dig into this for days. So please stop me, guide me here, like interrupt.
08:05.97
Lorie Jones
Yeah.
08:08.06
Candice Mitchell
ah But yes, we develop learning and development professionals, both in corporate, so corporate teams, but also funny enough, consultants, I didn’t actually start out doing that.
08:19.93
Candice Mitchell
But we’ve attracted a few consultants coming in, with the same need. They always say the same thing. I want to expand my impact for my clients. So i don’t just want to come in and do this once off training. i actually want to partner with them. I want to partner with them for a long time.
08:36.95
Candice Mitchell
ah Funny enough, and it was never intentional, but I consult with my clients and I’ll end up spending two to three years with the same client. And I find that that’s way easier than getting new clients all the time. And it’s literally through this framework that we do.
08:54.75
Candice Mitchell
So the Talent Development Academy has seven courses.
08:55.21
Lorie Jones
Mm-hmm.
08:58.15
Candice Mitchell
We do 30 plus hours of coaching. And I say, it’s no one-way webinars. Like, please, we’ve had enough of that. So it’s actually coaching. I am on the other end or we get expert coaches in once a month at least to take people through little niches so like how to facilitate for impact and that sort of thing. So we bring in expert coaches and I am there. I do office hours. We do some happy hours because we also need to connect and have fun and meet and build relationships, right? So yeah, we we promise no less than 30 plus hours of life coaching for the membership, which is 12 months and the seven on demand courses.
09:41.28
Lorie Jones
I love that. And that allows you to like develop those deep relationships and kind of really make an impact in these companies.
09:48.63
Candice Mitchell
that is That is the point. I, yeah again, love it.
09:50.61
Lorie Jones
Yeah.
09:52.21
Candice Mitchell
I love working with these people. And I really believe, and as I do more research, I truly believe learning and development is going to be that epicenter of the business.
10:03.32
Candice Mitchell
It has to be because with this AI and all the turmoil in the world that we need deep dive into the human and the human side of work and learning and development, people really sit at the epicenter of that.
10:18.70
Candice Mitchell
So yeah. again, privileged to support these people. Yeah.
10:22.66
Lorie Jones
love that. And I love people who love their jobs. It makes me so happy when when they like what they do because it it brings a whole new sense of, oh, this is so cool. Yeah, I like that.
10:34.07
Candice Mitchell
yeah
10:35.51
Lorie Jones
Tell me, Candice, what is the best investment you’ve made in yourself? If you can kind of look back over your journey and just say, oh my gosh, I am so glad that i i did this particular thing. It made all the difference.
10:50.52
Candice Mitchell
Yeah, and i that is so good and such a good question to ask because we are bombarded with choices. I was actually just saying to one of my board members today, i was like, there there are so many opportunities to spend money and I don’t know where to spend the right money you know, for the right things and the value for money and all of that stuff. So I would say the best money I’ve spent is on a few business coaches that really have helped me think of myself as a business owner rather than just, ah you know, like a consultant or and not just a consultant because I love that part. But
11:33.37
Candice Mitchell
running a business where I’m not a bottleneck. So that has been really helpful for me is is a specific business coach that really helped me see setting up systems that are bigger than me, that can run without me, you know, that I just stopped getting in my own way.
11:50.71
Candice Mitchell
um I’ve also spent some money on mindset coaching, which was huge because at first I was like, why me?
11:50.95
Lorie Jones
right.
11:58.03
Candice Mitchell
Who am I to think that I can possibly, you know, train people up on this thing where they are experts. And, you know, so I actually had to do a lot of mindset work. And through that,
12:10.36
Candice Mitchell
I believe that I am the person to take, you know, people through this. I do know what I’m talking about. i am good at what I do. And that took a long time just for me to say it out loud. I’m still a little bit hesitant and I can feel, you can even still feel my chest closing and my throat. And I’m like, just to say that is hard, you know?
12:35.01
Candice Mitchell
So I’ve had to put a lot of work in that. So those are the big things that, investment-wise money spent, that really helped me a lot.
12:45.08
Lorie Jones
Yeah, I noticed that even in my profession, that there’s a lot of that, like imposter syndrome, like, um can I, it why should they be paying, you know, me to do this?
12:57.25
Lorie Jones
And And I find that as women, a lot of times we downplay what we do rather than shout it from the rooftops. know
13:05.94
Candice Mitchell
Yes, yes. and and And truly, that’s why I honestly love what you’re doing. um And I would like to call this out. And hopefully people listening, women listening, is to say yes more.
13:20.66
Candice Mitchell
So i honestly, I’ve reached out, and it’s a sad thing to admit, but I’ve reached out to a few people to, for example, sit on my Talent Collective Council.
13:34.04
Candice Mitchell
the men say yes more than the women, you know, and I’m like, I want fair representation on my board, but I’m not getting the yeses.
13:41.13
Lorie Jones
you
13:44.28
Candice Mitchell
you know, and and I’m wondering why, and i’m I’m just wondering, like, do we struggle with trust? um You know, and that’s just that’s not, i I would love for more women, but yeah, I’ve got 75% men, 25% women on my board. and and in fact, I’m still actually trying to convince the women to join. um So yeah, that’s,
14:09.53
Candice Mitchell
when we say we need to believe in ourselves, we also need to believe in each other and be each other’s biggest cheerleaders.
14:16.79
Lorie Jones
Yeah, I find that too. Even like when I ask women if they’ll do the podcast, a lot of times they’ll say, oh, I’m not, i don’t do anything cool. I don’t do anything amazing. And then you find, i you know, they agree and you find out that they’re just doing these absolutely groundbreaking work in a lot of different places. And you’re like, how how can you not know how cool you are?
14:41.18
Candice Mitchell
I know that is so true. Yes. Like, yeah, if you take one thing from this podcast is to firstly believe in yourself, but also just to say yes more like I’ll say it again. Because yeah, when I reach out to people to be on my podcast, same, same thing.
14:57.32
Candice Mitchell
You know, I had someone that helped me and he was like, I’m going to help you for free to set up this podcast. But as long as you have fair representation, right i want to see 50% men and 50% women. And I’m like, yeah, sure.
15:10.26
Candice Mitchell
That has been harder to do than I ever thought.
15:14.72
Lorie Jones
Yeah. Yeah.
15:16.18
Candice Mitchell
Crazy.
15:17.27
Lorie Jones
getting Getting a woman to stand up and say how cool she is. It’s hard sometimes and they are so cool.
15:24.47
Candice Mitchell
yes
15:25.46
Lorie Jones
what um Candice, what’s the worst advice someone gave you? Can you ever think of some really, really bad advice? And did you take the advice?
15:34.23
Candice Mitchell
I did, yes. i want to put it out there, the most stupid thing, honestly, and please learn from me. Please learn from me i yeah I’ll take you back a couple years because…
15:48.60
Candice Mitchell
And I really wanted to grow, right? This business, this idea, this membership, like I can’t love it more. I actually can’t believe in it more. um I am so convinced that this is what the industry needs, right? Like I know, but I wanted to grow this thing fast.
16:08.38
Candice Mitchell
And so two years ago, when I was like, just starting out, you know, I just had a minimum, minimal viable product. i was like, I’m ready. And I want to grow my Instagram account because that’s what people do, right? You become an influencer and then you can like sell your thing. And that’s amazing, right? Like the results, it’s amazing. So I’m like following people on Instagram. I’m thinking, okay, who can help me do those? Because I don’t know what I’m doing, right? i’m a li I’m a millennial, like trying to figure out this Instagram. I feel I’m not cool enough. So I get these people on board. They’re going to do this done for you service, blah, blah, blah. I’m like, great, I’m in. I spend so much money, where so much money. it is sickening um of how much I spent with these people. And they said, okay, as long as you follow what we say exactly, right? So like, here’s the real script. Here’s the script for your reel. Here’s what we need to put on your post carousel.
17:06.74
Candice Mitchell
So I go along with this and then eventually I’m like, but I’m lying. Like I’m literally lying. And I say this to them. I’m like, I haven’t helped hundreds of people. I’ve helped maybe 12, you know, in this capacity. Like, yes, I’ve supported tens of thousands of people in their development. Sure, but not, I haven’t supported hundreds of learning and development professionals in this capacity. So can we just change this? Sure, they changed this, then I’m not getting the growth. And they’re like, yeah, but it’s because you’re changing the script. I’m like, I’m not changing the script. I’m not lying. you know
17:42.90
Lorie Jones
the truth
17:43.64
Candice Mitchell
Yeah. And so they were like, well, you’re not getting the growth because you’re not saying the things. And eventually, like we actually almost landed up in small claims courts and so a whole disaster. So what the whole point of this story is like, don’t believe it when it’s too good to be true. Right. And I fell for it because I want the so bad. I want this program to do well so badly that certain things blinded me and I feel like really silly and embarrassed and it’s a story I don’t love to share because I really feel embarrassed but I feel like I have to share it because so many people want the dream and want to achieve these things so badly that they kind of fall for the too good to be true but that is usually too good to be true.
18:35.61
Lorie Jones
Yeah, i I think it’s interesting what you said earlier, just about the fact that there are so many things we can spend our money on. And they all like ah I, you know, as a business owner, like they all sound good. i want all the things I want to be famous on LinkedIn and Facebook and, you know, Instagram and Instagram. have people vying for my services and, and do every, like, they’re really good at getting you to do those things.
19:04.16
Candice Mitchell
Yeah.
19:04.44
Lorie Jones
How do you figure out which ones are actually going to, to drive your growth in a way that feels real and authentic?
19:13.44
Candice Mitchell
Yeah.
19:13.58
Lorie Jones
And I think that’s the important point coming back to it is like if, if it was, if you were feeling authentic in that space, um,
19:14.24
Candice Mitchell
Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm.
19:17.40
Candice Mitchell
yeah
19:23.19
Lorie Jones
then then what they were doing would have been you know good, but it wasn’t wasn’t real. Ooh.
19:28.66
Candice Mitchell
Yeah, it wasn’t. It wasn’t real. Yeah. and how I have since chosen partners, because now I do have a social media partner who’s doing a fantastic job and I love her and her team. um They asked me questions.
19:44.47
Candice Mitchell
And just that I was like, oh, they actually want to know about my business. They actually want to know what I do who I serve, the benefits of the program and all of the things. And I gave them so much because I mean, by that point, I had so much content written, and I’ve got a blog and I actually went through the stuff and said, okay, so these are the points, this is the, you know, and I was like, yeah, you’re hired for sure.
20:13.14
Candice Mitchell
but You know, just that little twist of like, not this is what we can do for you, but what do you want to achieve?
20:13.36
Lorie Jones
Yeah.
20:20.70
Candice Mitchell
Just that little twist is like, okay, that’s my now radar, ah my, you know, BS meter. Like how many questions do you ask me?
20:28.77
Lorie Jones
That was so interesting. Yeah.
20:31.33
Candice Mitchell
Yeah.
20:31.58
Lorie Jones
Yeah. I never thought of it that way before, but yes, those, those businesses, and those partners that I have that do the best things for me are always the ones that I want that relationship with.
20:44.64
Lorie Jones
I want that back and forth questions. And that’s what honestly I do with my clients. Like I, I want to know them inside and out And and know all their hopes and dreams and, you know, greatest, greatest fears and greatest dreams.
20:59.12
Lorie Jones
And so i think that I think that that does kind of flow through to this idea of this.
20:59.31
Candice Mitchell
Yes.
21:05.08
Lorie Jones
That is a really good test. I’m going to put that in my brain bank and think about that a little bit. bit
21:11.19
Candice Mitchell
Yes, it took me quite a few bruises and scrapes to figure that out. So… I hope I save at least one person the pain.
21:21.82
Lorie Jones
So what about um a do-over? So we kind of all have situations that we look back on and we’re like, oh my gosh, I would do that so much differently now.
21:33.85
Lorie Jones
Like I know something more, obviously going back, if we knew the same thing, we’d do it the same way. But what if you could go back and do something and know everything that you know today? Is there a situation that you would do over and help?
21:47.96
Candice Mitchell
Yeah, oh, gosh. And i try not to think about this. Actually, I try to frame it as the mistakes learned, the bruises, the bumps got me to where I am now. But yes, if there was a time in my life that I could go back and do things differently. And and look, it actually ended up the best thing ever, but in the moment.
22:13.34
Candice Mitchell
So I was a employee. So not running my own business. So in this situation, ah was yeah an employee. I’m super ambitious. So I was promoted.
22:27.54
Candice Mitchell
And within my first month, I went into my boss’s office and he knew me well because I was promoted within the same team. and i I went there, I was like, okay, what’s going to get me to the next promotion? And he was like, oh seriously, like you’ve just been promoted. Like, ah have you even got your first paycheck? And I’m like, yeah, but my next promotion is coming up in two years time.
22:50.30
Candice Mitchell
What do I need to do to get there? Because I don’t want to arrive in two years and figure out I’m not ready. So after a few bit of our rolling, we actually put a plan together and i did the plan and I did it so well. So I got a walk on water performance review. So like the top.
23:09.85
Candice Mitchell
So I was the top two performer of 800 plus HR team. um I was moved laterally into another team because where I was was doing so well that I was moved to like get this other team up and running better. And I got put on this prestigious business program. So a prestigious business school and i did like a postgraduate, I have like a little mini MBA, it was called Global global Leadership.
23:40.55
Lorie Jones
Mm-hmm.
23:41.18
Candice Mitchell
And the company paid. So only, I think there were 12 of us and the company’s like 10,000 plus. So really like I’m this niche little very high performing person.
23:52.22
Candice Mitchell
Then the promotion comes up and of course I apply and I’m shortlisted and I prepare for the thing like nothing before. And funny enough, I still have the interview presentations and it’s still like this was 13 years ago.
24:08.82
Candice Mitchell
it is still good. Like, so I did well, but I didn’t get that promotion.
24:10.62
Lorie Jones
Mm-hmm.
24:15.28
Candice Mitchell
Spoiler alert. And in hindsight, I realized why. So this is where I would do it differently, was that I never spoke about what I was doing, right? I like got all these things and I got to ah the performance, but I never, i wasn’t like business partnering, talking to the the right stakeholders, right? So the person who got the job was in learning and development less than two years.
24:41.82
Candice Mitchell
got the promotion, but it’s because she built all these relationships. Right, she was in the right rooms, speaking with the right people.
24:47.09
Lorie Jones
Mm-hmm.
24:49.62
Candice Mitchell
And that was such a good lesson in life. whether you’re in corporate, whether you have your own business. And now I always say, just network before you need it. Like you think you’re on the right track or you think your work will speak for itself. That’s another, that’s a whole chapter in my book. But um it doesn’t. Like you have to be so deliberate on telling people what you’re doing, the impact you’re having, all the things. It matters so much that That is the one thing I would do differently because, yeah, I probably would have got that promotion. You know, I was ticking all the boxes, but just not speaking to the right people.
25:30.84
Lorie Jones
So that is that is a really, really good way of putting it, but so hard for me. Like it is hard for, and we were just talking about how women are like, oh, I don’t do anything cool or i’m not a, you know. So how do you how do you brag without being braggy?
25:47.48
Candice Mitchell
Oh, yes. and And actually, so today I’m going to finish my book, by the way. so um it is all fresh in my mind. That’s why I’m so easily able to answer these questions. Not because I live this, not yet. It’s not ingrained yet. But how do you speak about what you do without bragging?
26:08.41
Candice Mitchell
you say things like, can we have a debrief meeting? So that’s actually what I do with my clients now. And it’s not about bragging and that’s not initially what i what my intention was at all. But I was like, yeah, let’s debrief. Let’s look at what we achieved. And then I go back and I say, OK, these were the original goals. This is what we did. So this was like the little intervention we rolled out.
26:30.01
Candice Mitchell
um This is you know how many people attended, but these were the comments. This was so actually client recently did this for. So they had in between assessment or like on the job exercise that they had to do. And I was just really taken aback with the detail and the depth that they did these um exercises with. And so that formed part of like, your managers are actually engaged and they want more resources and they want to help their teams. And, you know, that was some of the reflection. And I built the ah HR team and CEO ready deck for them to go and present of like the impact. But that is a great example of how you saying what you did and the impact you had without saying like,
27:19.35
Candice Mitchell
Yeah, without bragging at all. You know, it’s it it’s not bragging at all. It’s just literally telling people what you did and the impact you had and the suggested next steps.
27:31.54
Candice Mitchell
And so in corporate, and it is actually a module within my program, is do a business case beforehand of what you’re aiming to achieve, and then always do that debrief afterwards.
27:45.45
Lorie Jones
Yeah. Mm-hmm.
27:45.72
Candice Mitchell
It’s essential because no one knows what you did. Like, I can’t scream that loud enough, but no one knows what you’ve done unless you tell them.
27:56.65
Lorie Jones
Oh, I love that. That’s a really good idea and a way to to put it it it it It isn’t like, hey, can I tell you how cool I am? It’s like, hey, let’s do a debrief of the how this situation went.
28:07.30
Lorie Jones
And it went really cool because you did great things. So that’s going to kind of bubble up to the surface during this debrief.
28:12.92
Candice Mitchell
Yeah, yeah. And truly, even if it didn’t go well, so when because that’s a question I get asked, okay, Candice, but if we have these goals, and they’re a bit big, these goals, you know, I’m not going to get there. And like, but that doesn’t matter. Because what you’re going to do is show them what you have done.
28:30.71
Candice Mitchell
And then your business mindset of saying, we didn’t quite achieve the results we wanted to. that’s why i think we missed the mark. And here’s what I suggest we do to keep going or to build on this or to, you know, whatever the case is. So it can work either way, whether you achieve them or not.
28:50.59
Lorie Jones
Yeah, I like that. i I like that way you frame that.
28:51.92
Candice Mitchell
Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm.
28:54.49
Lorie Jones
What about um if you go back across your journey and high five yourself? This is my favorite question, by the way, because I love finance so much. But if you could go back and high five yourself for one great past financial decision, what would it be?
29:10.23
Candice Mitchell
is to save. I know that sounds so boring. So boring. Oh my goodness. But I have saved.
29:21.46
Candice Mitchell
So every time I got a promotion at work, I actually put more money into my savings. So I got few, and this is rands, so not even dollars. So i I allowed myself like probably the equivalent of $100 if I got like a $500 increase, let’s say. i allowed myself that little bit of extra spending money, but I would take the rest and put it away.
29:47.83
Candice Mitchell
And that account, so I was in corporate for 10 years and It was a savings account within the corporate structure that investors and all of that. And like that money has saved me because when we moved overseas, like I needed some, you know, some money, I’d and I couldn’t work for a long time, it like really hit me and yeah, that money literally saved me.
30:12.60
Candice Mitchell
And so it’s it was like, I didn’t need more, um don’t know, you’ll have the words, income, spendable income, whatever that’s called.
30:21.61
Lorie Jones
Mm-hmm.
30:22.33
Candice Mitchell
um
30:23.13
Lorie Jones
Disposable income, yeah.
30:24.22
Candice Mitchell
There we go. was like, I didn’t need that.
30:25.25
Lorie Jones
Mm-hmm.
30:26.78
Candice Mitchell
Like, I didn’t go and buy more bags or, you know, I didn’t like go and buy more shoes. I don’t need that stuff. ah and That’s just me. I actually said to my friend this week, we had a business meeting and I was like, if you ever see me upgrade this bag, you know, like I’ve gone cuckoo.
30:43.05
Candice Mitchell
Like,
30:43.93
Lorie Jones
I’ve made it to the stratosphere.
30:45.14
Candice Mitchell
let me don let me upgrade my bag.
30:46.29
Lorie Jones
Yeah.
30:49.14
Candice Mitchell
ah Keep me grounded. Yeah, that’s just a quirky thing about me.
30:52.82
Lorie Jones
um Yeah,
30:55.26
Candice Mitchell
But anyway, so when I got the more disposable income, I put it away instead of like just spending it because you’ll spend it so easy. That’s the best.
31:04.41
Lorie Jones
yes you do. and And I find that, you know, in in my own, in my own life is like, if i if I don’t save first, if I don’t put the savings in first, then you grow into that income, don’t you?
31:17.78
Candice Mitchell
Oh, 100%. Yes. Yes. And it doesn’t have to be a lot. Like you don’t need to wait. oh wait until I earn X amount. Like no, put 50 bucks away. Put a hundred bucks away. it Like just little tiny baby. as It’s all adds up.
31:32.48
Lorie Jones
Yeah, just a little bit consistently over time. Exactly.
31:35.16
Candice Mitchell
Yeah.
31:35.49
Lorie Jones
so
31:35.56
Candice Mitchell
Yeah. Probably the most boring answer you’ve ever got. I don’t know.
31:38.46
Lorie Jones
I know, but I love the boring answer.
31:38.99
Candice Mitchell
Yeah.
31:40.30
Lorie Jones
I’m a finance person.
31:40.89
Candice Mitchell
f
31:41.26
Lorie Jones
and I love the boring answers. They’re my favorites, right? You don’t have to do big, grand gestures. You just do a little bit. It’s the little decisions that make a big difference.
31:51.96
Lorie Jones
Yeah.
31:52.02
Candice Mitchell
yeah
31:53.14
Lorie Jones
What scared you the most when you first started your career? And does it still scare you? Or did you figure out how to handle it?
32:02.10
Candice Mitchell
What scared me the most when I started my career?
32:09.85
Candice Mitchell
When I started, i was actually more fearless than I am now. So i can’t say when I started, I was scared. So when I… what I was scared of was not getting the job I wanted.
32:21.94
Candice Mitchell
Like i was determined to get into this company in this career.
32:22.21
Lorie Jones
Mm-hmm.
32:29.08
Candice Mitchell
um and my boss, the same boss I asked i to give me the promotion when I had just got the promotion, the same guy um was like, Candice, if you go into, you know, HR, you would have so many more opportunities. And I was like, no, I’m staying in learning and development. And he was like, he eventually was like, you’re so stubborn. Like your career could be more.
32:55.38
Candice Mitchell
So, um i and I think I still have that stubbornness. I’m like, no, I love what I do. And it’s something, i don’t know, I’m not willing to give up.
33:07.57
Candice Mitchell
I’m just not willing to give up that feeling of, Literally, I cannot wait to get to my computer every day and work on this business. So I think what I’m, so I’m not really answering your question, but I’m answering in a roundabout way is what I’m scared of is have I said no to things that I should have said yes to because I’m stubborn and not maybe seeing different opportunities perhaps. So It’s more a fear in hindsight that maybe I’ve done. I don’t know. I’ll never know because I don’t know the stubbornness will ever go away.
33:49.98
Candice Mitchell
um
33:50.05
Lorie Jones
Yeah.
33:51.64
Candice Mitchell
Yeah, so i I narrowed my path too much is maybe what I’m fearing.
33:54.23
Lorie Jones
But sometimes, yeah, Sometimes that straight line path, though, helps you to focus on what’s important to you and and find your real purpose, you know, like what you were put here to do.
34:08.92
Candice Mitchell
Yeah, investigationiness
34:10.58
Lorie Jones
But I can see where you’d be like, but am I missing out on other things that might fulfill me or because I’m so focused on something?
34:21.65
Lorie Jones
Yeah.
34:21.94
Candice Mitchell
yeah, yeah, that is a fear that, you know, I, that comes across my mind every now and then.
34:30.14
Lorie Jones
I never really thought of it that way. I’ve always struggled because I do see so many other places that i could i could um you know do things and focusing in on the thing that i love with all my heart in this finance sort of thing.
34:44.40
Lorie Jones
So I i i struggle to make sure and and keep myself in my lane. Yeah. not do all the things. So so it’s not it’s something that i I hadn’t really thought about in the opposite way.
34:54.17
Candice Mitchell
Yes, yes, yes. Yeah.
34:59.65
Lorie Jones
That’s really interesting.
35:00.16
Candice Mitchell
Yeah. Yeah.
35:02.55
Lorie Jones
What about through your journey? Have you faced any unique challenges because you were a woman?
35:15.19
Candice Mitchell
series
35:20.82
Candice Mitchell
It’s strange. So in my field,
35:26.22
Candice Mitchell
it’s mostly women. So i’ mean, learning and development, which is typically a support function within HR, typically women. Right. So we would have, i don’t know, 80% women and a man, and I see So maybe I’m just too naive to believe this happened to me But I see that when you hit direct to level plus that it then it switches. So it switches 100%.
35:56.76
Candice Mitchell
one hundred percent so it’s in the lower level, it’s in the higher level, it’s men, twenty percent woman you know so i believe i’ve i’m on this path because I want to be, but perhaps because it was also limiting. So you know in I really struggled to find work in America at my level, probably because people didn’t know me, but also you know did a woman come into play? maybe
36:35.64
Candice Mitchell
You know, the roles were filled by not women, by a lot of men.
36:36.48
Lorie Jones
Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm.
36:41.85
Candice Mitchell
and And you just see that pendulum swing. and it And it’s a thing and not unique to my industry. You know you know it too in these typical You’re in a typical man industry where I am in a typical woman industry.
36:59.16
Candice Mitchell
But when it comes to leadership, it swings. So it’s just interesting, like how many women I speak to that are struggling to find work because they’re at that level and there’s just opportunities not there. Right. So i’ve forged my own path.
37:17.11
Candice Mitchell
because again, I’m crazy ambitious. so um But it’s it’s the harder path, to be honest. It’s the harder route forward.
37:27.67
Candice Mitchell
It’s not, you know, I never want to glamorize entrepreneurship or anything like that. That’s definitely, it’s not for everyone. It’s hard. um
37:35.62
Lorie Jones
Mm-hmm.
37:36.47
Candice Mitchell
You know, but I think… Yeah. And what I mean, and there’s so many things, right? I mean, and I know there’s big strides in place, but, you know, speaking engagements, you never know, because you don’t know if they’re not choosing you because you’re woman, but then when you see the speakers, it’s mostly men.
37:56.15
Candice Mitchell
yeah You know, so you can you start to see the patterns, but it’s never like, no, you’re not getting chosen because you’re woman. It’s just, no, we’ve chosen these other speakers because they’re, you know, stronger whatever the case is.
38:08.85
Candice Mitchell
And so you’ll always see and you’ll see the same voices in the circuits and they’re mostly men. And, you know, so it’s it’s never so overt, right?
38:19.36
Candice Mitchell
Like that’s why it’s hard to pinpoint and it’s hard to…
38:19.99
Lorie Jones
Yeah.
38:25.21
Candice Mitchell
Like even answer this question with facts.
38:27.45
Lorie Jones
Yeah, that is interesting because, ah you know,
38:29.78
Candice Mitchell
Yeah.
38:32.82
Lorie Jones
um you do see that it’s not necessarily a glass ceiling. You can see some women getting through, but the, but you’re right.
38:42.33
Candice Mitchell
Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm.
38:43.35
Lorie Jones
It flip-flops to, you know, about 80% men in those upper level is, is it because of their network?
38:48.55
Candice Mitchell
Mm-hmm.
38:50.55
Lorie Jones
Is it because of their, um is it because of their chances for education or promotion? oh and and does that,
38:59.53
Candice Mitchell
Yeah.
39:01.53
Lorie Jones
push women into more of a, I can’t, I I’m here. i can’t go any further. i i just can’t break that. i can’t break into that in a meaningful way into that next level.
39:14.12
Lorie Jones
So entrepreneurship, like doing it on my own is really the only way to do it. That’s a really interesting idea.
39:20.66
Candice Mitchell
yeah
39:23.32
Candice Mitchell
Yeah. And I’d like to circle, like just loop this piece in of the trust factor is you know, when we’re reaching out to women, they are more likely to say no to be on our podcasts. They’re more likely to say no to be on my board, you know, my very lived experience. They’re more likely to say no to be in my network in my, because I have growth partnership network, mostly men.
39:45.91
Candice Mitchell
and And I keep thinking, why? you know Why are you saying no? And I think it’s a it’s a trust issue from the systemic stuff.
39:56.89
Candice Mitchell
like you know I don’t think it’s that they don’t trust me. It’s that they have this trust thing, yeah which I think we need to work on.
40:07.42
Lorie Jones
Yeah, that’s so interesting. i love the way you framed that.
40:09.20
Candice Mitchell
Yeah.
40:11.32
Lorie Jones
um Candice, what is the thing you are most proud of?
40:16.77
Candice Mitchell
Oh, man.
40:18.53
Lorie Jones
I know that’s a big, tough question, isn’t it?
40:20.09
Candice Mitchell
It is. I’m going to say truly, and and it’s something I actually say to my husband, is my resilience. I cannot believe I’m still going. um you know, now I’m seeing the light of day But for two years, i have gone, i have worked on this, on specifically the Talent Development Academy with this unshakable knowing that it’s great and that it needs to be in people’s lives.
40:39.48
Lorie Jones
Thank you.
40:57.30
Candice Mitchell
But what got me here, like, and I’ll say to him, I say, like, I cannot believe I don’t just binge watch Netflix and feel sorry for myself. look It is unbelievable, my level of resilience and belief in myself and what I’ve created.
41:13.45
Lorie Jones
Mm-hmm.
41:21.50
Candice Mitchell
So yeah, I would say that my resilience is, is I don’t even know is crazy. Like I’m like, am I resilient? Or am I just like b blindly crazy? i like But I think it’s resilience.
41:36.58
Candice Mitchell
I do, because the more people I show the program to, the more people i speak with and i engage and high level people, like I call them Taylor Swifts of my industry, like literally they don’t need to even speak to me, nevermind agree with me, you know, that this thing is good.
41:53.64
Candice Mitchell
And so, you know, it’s been my, and I say it’s moved now from my opinion to actually being a thing.
41:56.95
Lorie Jones
just how women
42:00.01
Lorie Jones
we we we do, we we we do, do, we do, we we we we we we we do, do, we do, do, do, do, do, do, do, do, we we do, do, we we do, we we do, we we we do, we do, we we
42:01.26
Candice Mitchell
So yeah, but my resilience got me here for sure.
42:15.86
Lorie Jones
we we just keep going. Like every day we wake up and we, and not only do we just keep doing it, but we keep doing it in a beautiful way that gives back and to like next generations and to those people around us. And, and,
42:35.29
Lorie Jones
And we’re so resilient, all of us collectively are so resilient at at at just m not not just doing the bare minimum, but actually really creating in this world.
42:38.91
Candice Mitchell
Yeah. Yeah.
42:47.94
Candice Mitchell
Mm-hmm.
42:50.49
Lorie Jones
That’s cool.
42:53.78
Lorie Jones
Any advice for a young lady who’s just starting down this path to help her be successful like you?
43:04.57
Candice Mitchell
Yeah, OK, my advice is and again, and I’m sorry to do this is just because it’s so fresh is from my book. So i have created, I’ve written a book, it’s called Choose You. It’s coming out in March, 2026. And it is all about choosing you for the people who refuse to be invisible. And it takes you through ah part one is where we get lost. Part two is how we show up in the workplace, bringing this invisibility with us. And then part three is all about finding yourself, stepping into your light, all of that.
43:39.77
Candice Mitchell
And the first pillar of that last part is remember who you are. And if I could give people one piece of advice, it is to not lose yourself. Don’t lose yourself the social media BS.
43:55.63
Candice Mitchell
Don’t lose yourself in the role you’re
43:56.00
Lorie Jones
you
44:00.37
Candice Mitchell
Don’t lose yourself in the role you need to play. You know, and some of the chapters are, you know, the copy paste teenager, the supportive spouse, the present parent.
44:12.69
Candice Mitchell
Don’t lose who you are in those moments in life because who you are is going to help in those moments of life. Like, yes, you can be a present parent without losing your identity. You can be a supportive spouse without stepping into the shadows yourself. And so that is what the one piece of advice I would give to young people is don’t lose who you are. You’re so amazing. like Write it down, have a list of your, you know, like someone calls it your badass list or whatever that looks like for you. But just remember your core and your values and never lose that.
44:49.68
Lorie Jones
I love that. I love that idea. just it sounds so simple too, doesn’t it? Just remember who you are. or Don’t lose yourself. But that is probably one of the hardest things that you have to do.
45:03.38
Candice Mitchell
Yeah, yeah.
45:04.92
Lorie Jones
Yeah, I love that. Thank you. Well, thank you so much, Candice, for spending your time here and for just sharing your journey and some of these really great insights like that’s going to take me just a minute or two to think about. um I can’t wait for your book to come out. If I have a ah someone who’s listening to this podcast who wants to pick your brain, take you out for coffee, virtual meeting, how do they get in touch with you?
45:32.41
Candice Mitchell
Yeah, they can get in touch with me through LinkedIn is probably the best way. Candice Mitchell, you’ll find me and For those listening that want to take it one step further, they can actually do the how invisible are you at work quiz, which then takes you, which gives you a personalized report afterwards and these steps. So the remember who you are is pillar one and it takes you through all five of the pillars of how to just rebuild yourself if you have found that you’ve lost yourself.
46:05.18
Lorie Jones
I like that. I’ll have to, but I’ll put the the link for that in our show notes for us.
46:09.23
Candice Mitchell
Mm-hmm. Yeah, I’ll give that to you for sure.
46:12.50
Lorie Jones
Yeah, I love it. Well, thank you so, so much. I really appreciate your time today.
46:16.40
Candice Mitchell
Yeah, absolutely. It’s been a pleasure.