In this episode, host Lorie Jones welcomes Lisa Allen, CEO of the Financial Transitionist Institute, for an inspiring and deeply honest conversation about mentorship, leadership, and the winding paths we take in our careers. Lisa shares her journey from aspiring magazine editor to accidental finance executive, revealing the pivotal moments, setbacks, and triumphs that have shaped her along the way.
You will hear candid insights about overcoming burnout, building supportive professional cultures, and the power of paying it forward to the next generation of women leaders. Lisa and Lorie get real about the unique challenges women face in male-dominated industries, reflect on the critical role of mentorship, and offer practical advice to young women at the start of their careers.
Whether you’re forging your path in finance, business, or any industry where breaking barriers matters, this episode is packed with wisdom, encouragement, and strategies to help you stay fearless and true to yourself. Get ready to be inspired by Lisa’s authenticity, resilience, and commitment to lifting others as she climbs.
Show Highlights:
- The power of adapting to nonlinear paths to work and entrepreneurship. [03:44]
- Learn about the Financial Transitionist Institute’s mission to humanize finance. [09:42]
- How to recognize burnout, notably high among women. [14:55]
- The importance of servant leadership and positive work culture. [19:05]
- How our words boost the growth, individuality and self-advocacy of younger women at work. [24:00]
- Can you find peace with “enough” at 80% over perfectionism? [28:44]
- Tips to beat industry anxiety, including mentoring and WIPN. [32:11]
- Do you advocate for yourself against sexism in your industry? [37:04]
- A tribute to indomitable resilience leading to all round success. [41:17]
- What you will gain by evaluating impactful experiences. [45:04]
To get in touch with Lisa Allen, email her at Lisa@financialtransitionist.com. Find her on LinkedIn at https://www.linkedin.com/in/lisaallen4722/.
If you enjoyed this episode, please go to Apple Podcasts and leave a review! For more information about Lorie Jones, go to https://fearlessfinancialadvisors.com/fearless-females.
00:01.38
Lorie Jones
Good morning, fearless females. I'm so excited that you can join us today. We've got Lisa Allen, who is the CEO of Financial Transitionist Institute. And I've known Lisa for a little bit over a year now, and I'm really excited to hear her story and her journey.
00:18.06
Lorie Jones
She's got some really great ideas. And thank you so much for joining us, Lisa. I appreciate it.
00:23.22
Lisa
Of course, I'm honored. Thanks for having me. i love your podcast. I love it for a million reasons, but also, especially I think because I love that you have women from the industry and then from outside the industry, those perspectives are awesome.
00:36.94
Lisa
So I listen to it when I'm walking my dog. It's good year.
00:41.54
Lorie Jones
Well, that's great. Good dog walking examples. Yeah, yeah perfect. So my first question is always, I'm a reader. i love reading.
00:51.87
Lorie Jones
What is your favorite book?
00:53.58
Lisa
I know this is your first question all the time.
00:55.82
Lorie Jones
hu
00:56.28
Lisa
And this is the worst question to ask an English major. Like if you don't read, I just trust you immediately. like um
01:05.34
Lorie Jones
That's my test too.
01:06.32
Lisa
And if you're not reading six books at once, I don't know if we can be friends. um So to ask me one, i thought about it because I knew this one was coming. All right. So um'm going to put it in a category, right? So I adore, you know,
01:23.11
Lisa
the classics. So I'm a giant Jane Austen fan. So Emma is my favorite of all the Jane Austens of all the classics of all of that. However, I am really into nonfiction these days for some reason.
01:37.10
Lisa
um So non-industry, nonfiction, I'm going to go with either, there's a biography of Jimmy Carter called His Very Best and kind timely this year because of Jimmy Carter.
01:49.38
Lorie Jones
um Oh.
01:53.12
Lisa
But regardless of politics and everything, is he you a good president or not? I don't know. But what a good man, what a good human. And so it's a big fat book. So if you're interested in that one, it's a great one.
02:04.56
Lisa
And then um one I think that's super timely for us right now is a book called Factfulness. And I would say of all the books that have impacted me in a way that it changes how I think and how I look at things, that's the one.
02:19.57
Lisa
And This one I feel like is super important to us right now because I mean, just that the onslaught of news that we can't figure out if it's true or false or just for a myriad of reasons and just kind of everything feels a little bit, I don't know, like negative right now.
02:30.59
Lorie Jones
Yeah. Yeah.
02:39.42
Lorie Jones
yeah
02:39.58
Lisa
Factfulness is a book that teaches you how to look at things, um not only from ah higher level perspective, but also to question the things you you hear and it trains your brain. So it's a really cool book for right now.
02:53.44
Lisa
and think it's like a hopeful book, um which I think we all need.
02:57.50
Lorie Jones
yeah
02:57.73
Lisa
I could go on. Let's do a whole podcast just on books.
03:01.17
Lorie Jones
I know I'm with you. i am the same way. i love reading. i love people who read. i have a whole stack of books and I actually did read Factfulness.
03:06.54
Lisa
Right?
03:10.58
Lorie Jones
That's the one that kind of goes through and talks about how much better off we are now using facts than we were.
03:15.80
Lisa
Yes.
03:17.21
Lorie Jones
Huh?
03:17.61
Lisa
Yes.
03:17.68
Lorie Jones
Yeah.
03:18.51
Lisa
Yeah. and and it And it teaches you to think about things like you think, oh, gosh, nothing has ever been this crazy. And or you back you you back up and, you know, you don't feel so despairing because things actually over time, humanity has actually done so much better over time if you just back up a little bit.
03:24.90
Lorie Jones
Yeah.
03:36.48
Lisa
So love that one, especially for today.
03:37.96
Lorie Jones
Yeah.
03:38.96
Lisa
Needed for today.
03:39.42
Lorie Jones
Yeah. Yeah, I did too. I thought that was great. And I thought that it was, it was actually one of my favorites a year or so ago when I read it. So I love that.
03:49.43
Lisa
Great gift book.
03:49.61
Lorie Jones
I, yeah, yeah, that actually, that is a really good idea.
03:50.53
Lisa
Gifted to all your friends.
03:54.77
Lorie Jones
I was actually going to gift it to someone. So that's idea.
03:56.98
Lisa
Everybody I give it to adores it. So, yeah, it's a great book.
04:01.66
Lorie Jones
And it's got a really fun quiz at the beginning that I failed miserably. So yeah.
04:05.68
Lisa
I failed it, too. I was horrified. I was like, this seems like I should know the answers to these questions. Just goes to show you, though, right?
04:14.18
Lorie Jones
Yeah. Yeah.
04:14.66
Lisa
Yeah.
04:15.99
Lorie Jones
So tell me a little bit about your journey, Lisa. Tell me how you got started.
04:19.83
Lisa
Yeah,
04:20.84
Lorie Jones
like where did you get where you're at today? and And what do you do today? Just talk to me a little bit about you.
04:26.19
Lisa
yeah so everybody, I think everybody I know, ah every single person doesn't say like, well, I went to school knowing I was going to be in finance.
04:36.54
Lisa
No.
04:36.98
Lorie Jones
Oh, yeah.
04:37.98
Lisa
So my falling into it story, everyone's got a falling into it story, right? um Was that I I graduated college. I was going to be, i thought, like a really famous editor. i was going to edit magazines, preferably Vogue and live in New York.
04:54.48
Lisa
That was who I was going to be.
04:54.59
Lorie Jones
yeah
04:56.70
Lisa
And there was no question. But then when I got out of school, I realized that actually doesn't happen to anyone. And so ah was desperate for a job. The job market was pretty terrible in those times. And I wound up like just no money, super poor out of school.
05:14.44
Lisa
I wound up going to one of the temp agencies just to do something, to pay rent. And they sent me to an air conditioning company who had me take a spelling test to see if I could answer their phones.
05:30.38
Lisa
And I walked out of there, you know, crying. because I just could not believe that that I was actually, that this is me, I'm gonna be a receptionist in an air conditioning company.
05:43.95
Lisa
And it was so far from my dreams, right? so Burst into tears and I get on the elevator and I met a guy who hired me in the elevator.
05:53.73
Lorie Jones
Oh, wow.
05:54.62
Lisa
because I was just crying and he was like, oh my goodness, what's happening? And was like, just graduated and I can't believe I'm here. I was just bawling. And he was like, you know what? I need somebody.
06:07.95
Lisa
You want to work in finance? And I was like, sure. but
06:12.20
Lorie Jones
Anything but air conditioning.
06:15.86
Lisa
So yeah, so i started there, um worked out at just like the front desk and that was a compliance firm. So I learned compliance. I worked for two compliance firms.
06:27.61
Lisa
And that is where i got like the basics, the technical information about the industry.
06:33.37
Lorie Jones
Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm.
06:35.24
Lisa
I didn't love it, but it was a great foundation for just knowing all the ins and outs, the who's who, the players, understanding who does what. um Did that for a few years. And then I started up with a couple of other people, an RIA firm.
06:50.91
Lisa
That is where I found out how much I adored starting something, like building something and figuring out that, oh, with like I like the idea of starting with nothing and building into something.
06:59.00
Lorie Jones
and
07:04.51
Lisa
So I realized I had that like entrepreneur kind of um thing inside me. And then i went to a trade association for two years for our industry.
07:15.97
Lisa
And learned about how to build out partnerships and how important partnerships are in our industry. Then hopped over to doing events for advisors for the industry.
07:30.09
Lorie Jones
Mm-hmm.
07:30.47
Lisa
And that is where I learned about community and how important community was. And now I feel like I'm taking all of that, like the technical, the the partnerships, community, marketing, sales, all of it.
07:45.28
Lisa
And I really feel like I'm at kind of the summit of my career. And I just started the CEO role at Financial Transitionist Institute in January.
07:56.58
Lisa
So I've been there a sum total of a month. But I've known Susan Bradley for a long time. She's lovely. And I admire the heck out of her.
08:06.89
Lisa
um She's been doing this for 25 years.
08:09.25
Lorie Jones
here
08:09.80
Lisa
So um we help advisors master the human side of financial transitions, um life transitions.
08:21.79
Lisa
um
08:21.80
Lorie Jones
Oh, yeah.
08:22.38
Lisa
I know you talked to Marla Sofer about this. Love Marla, love what she does.
08:24.34
Lorie Jones
Yeah.
08:26.25
Lisa
And along the same lines of what she said, we're as an industry, we're great at the technical and we're terrible. at the human.
08:35.90
Lorie Jones
Yeah. Terrible.
08:36.64
Lisa
Terrible. So I'm out to change that now.
08:42.00
Lorie Jones
I love that. I love that mission statement because it's a big job, but it it'll give you all of that entrepreneur building sort of spirit that you want.
08:43.00
Lisa
Yeah.
08:48.74
Lisa
Right?
08:51.84
Lorie Jones
So when you started the RIA, were you an advisor at that point or were you
08:52.74
Lisa
Yeah.
08:58.91
Lisa
I got licensed.
09:00.30
Lorie Jones
Uh-huh.
09:00.93
Lisa
It was a kind of a project for the the couple that I was working with already at the compliance firm.
09:08.96
Lorie Jones
Yeah. Mm-hmm.
09:09.15
Lisa
And it did get licensed and likely would have, you know, life happens, right?
09:09.22
Lorie Jones
Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm.
09:14.11
Lisa
But I likely would have stayed there.
09:14.57
Lorie Jones
you know
09:16.75
Lisa
I likely would have either stayed at the firm or i would have, um, like started my own firm probably. And us, except for, i had my daughter um,
09:25.79
Lorie Jones
hu
09:32.07
Lisa
She was born with an illness and those who are entrepreneurs know that it is incredibly hard to have your own gig or work at a ah startup when you've got health insurance problems, frankly.
09:33.69
Lorie Jones
know
09:48.12
Lorie Jones
Yeah. Yeah.
09:49.54
Lisa
Yeah.
09:50.37
Lorie Jones
Health issues. And yeah, that insurance is a big piece, especially for entrepreneurs. and And we end up seeing that a lot.
09:56.99
Lisa
It's almost an overcomable situation. non overcomable hurdle, at least it was back then.
10:03.38
Lorie Jones
Yeah.
10:04.88
Lisa
And I don't think it's heck of lot better today. Yeah.
10:07.28
Lorie Jones
Yeah.
10:07.76
Lisa
Yeah.
10:07.90
Lorie Jones
Yeah. they're still They still haven't come up with a solution for it, but you can pay a lot of money if you want the health insurance as an entrepreneur, but
10:11.68
Lisa
yeah
10:17.26
Lorie Jones
but not Not a good solution. Well, that that's so interesting.
10:19.57
Lisa
yeah
10:20.74
Lorie Jones
that's i think it's um funny, not funny, but that that you were ah dropped into finance because you were not going to the ah ah air conditioning.
10:32.76
Lisa
not going to any air conditioning.
10:34.47
Lorie Jones
Yeah.
10:37.05
Lisa
Yeah.
10:38.06
Lorie Jones
ah That's funny. Yeah, i I was a history major. So, but I i do have an intern that came in knowing at age 18 that she wanted to do finance, but that's a big one.
10:50.76
Lisa
That's so rare, at least in my experience, that is so rare.
10:51.91
Lorie Jones
I know.
10:53.60
Lisa
No one that I never meet people who are, you know, i grew up wanting to be in finance.
10:54.69
Lorie Jones
Yeah,
10:59.36
Lorie Jones
yeah, yeah.
11:00.19
Lisa
Yeah.
11:00.29
Lorie Jones
yeah So tell me, Lisa, what's the best investment you've made in yourself? Is there something that you can kind of look back on and you're like, oh my goodness, I'm so glad I did that. It made all the difference in my life and my career.
11:14.83
Lisa
i have to say for sure, i mean, I've done a lot flipping between a couple of things, but I think the very best investment in my so has been in my health, my mental health, my physical health, my spiritual health.
11:32.30
Lorie Jones
Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm.
11:36.95
Lisa
And when I say spiritual health, I don't mean religion. I'm kind of in a weird, mid-life thing where I'm grappling with all that. like But I mean spiritual health in the sense that I'm looking for like purpose and you those sorts of things.
11:54.31
Lisa
And found myself experiencing actual burnout. So kind of my here comes my ah my soapbox about burnout. So burnout is not stress, everyone listening.
12:07.99
Lisa
Yeah. There is a difference between burnout stress and I experienced actual burnout. And when you experience that, it is a, it's a life altering experience and for sure it was for me.
12:21.71
Lisa
So I had a ah moment where my lovely husband gave me an ultimatum and said, this is it.
12:28.21
Lorie Jones
Okay.
12:30.43
Lisa
Like the work is just, he said, you're going to be one of those women that has a heart attack at 50. I was working,
12:35.74
Lorie Jones
Yeah.
12:38.18
Lisa
just 78 hours a week. I was living on coffee in the morning and wine at night. but
12:44.08
Lorie Jones
Yeah.
12:44.76
Lisa
And it was, it was bad. And thankfully, my husband gave me that ultimatum.
12:50.55
Lorie Jones
Mm-hmm.
12:51.02
Lisa
That was kind of the pivotal moment.
12:51.13
Lorie Jones
Mm-hmm.
12:52.95
Lisa
And it really did just sort of change my perspective on everything.
12:58.40
Lorie Jones
here
12:58.96
Lisa
Everything from where I worked physically, like I live at the beach now, um to how I think about everything in terms of my values and and focusing on myself and having really strict boundaries for myself.
13:12.12
Lorie Jones
Mm-hmm.
13:13.85
Lisa
For sure.
13:13.83
Lorie Jones
So let's talk about that a minute because I am always so interested in the idea of burnout because, ah you know, like as women, we do, we take on more and more and more.
13:24.97
Lisa
Yep.
13:25.18
Lorie Jones
Like, did, did you see it coming or it literally was your husband?
13:28.46
Lisa
No.
13:29.85
Lorie Jones
Yeah.
13:30.25
Lisa
That's the thing about burnout. Don't even get this. We'll do a separate podcast on books and another one about burnout.
13:36.85
Lorie Jones
Yeah.
13:37.21
Lisa
So the dangerous thing about burnout is that when you're actually in burnout, real actual burnout, you don't know you're in burnout. It's sort of this numbing, and it's not denial because you understand like you're exhausted and you can't think straight and all the things, but all of a sudden you're just
13:45.85
Lorie Jones
Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm.
13:55.42
Lisa
completely numbed to everything. So it's almost, it's very hard to explain, but to me, i always say when I'm talking to people about this, that you know how very often when they're talking about mental health and and the experts will say depression, people don't necessarily feel like sad.
14:11.86
Lisa
I find burnout the same way. Burnout is you just get to a point where you're just, you're just done and you get completely numb.
14:21.29
Lorie Jones
yeah
14:21.60
Lisa
um Similar. And so, um yeah, I didn't recognize it at all. I saw myself as this like DC power constantly working. it's It's something that's really, you know, you live in DC and it is very much encouraged there. It's sort of a lifestyle there.
14:42.00
Lorie Jones
Yeah.
14:42.17
Lisa
That's why I'm at the beach. Yeah. Yeah.
14:45.24
Lorie Jones
Yeah. Yeah. What about, is there a way to tell the difference between just exhaustion which happens and burnout is there ah way to see that or do you have to like and tell your husband what this the things are and make sure that he sees it
15:02.28
Lisa
Yeah, I think that there's certainly um very specific things that I saw. Obviously, I've you know i've been in finance. We all are. And and so, you know, you you recognize stress.
15:15.13
Lorie Jones
mm-hmm
15:15.87
Lisa
So burnout for me was very different in that you lose interest in much anything that pretty much anything for me, it was pretty much anything that had to do with work. So I became unlike myself.
15:32.91
Lisa
I would say that's the biggest thing is I didn't recognize myself.
15:33.04
Lorie Jones
Yeah.
15:37.36
Lisa
Um, it was, uh, it was very odd time and it was probably went on for a couple of years, but, uh, the way that I interacted with people would not be my normal, my normal self. I was so,
15:53.49
Lisa
burnt out and tired. And, you know, I was dealing and it wasn't just work. I was dealing with raising a daughter with an illness at the same time. i had to homeschool her while I was working full time at a pretty intense job, you know, all of it together.
16:00.41
Lorie Jones
yeah
16:06.79
Lisa
It was just, it just shut me down. And so I would say, um I wasn't, I didn't feel like I could really get super happy about anything. And I wasn't super sad about anything.
16:18.39
Lisa
i didn't really care about things. And I'm not someone who doesn't care about things. I,
16:22.53
Lorie Jones
Yeah.
16:23.41
Lisa
very much throw myself into work and get very, almost to a point of problematic attached to my work.
16:27.95
Lorie Jones
Passionate.
16:31.75
Lorie Jones
Yeah.
16:32.39
Lisa
um It all just disconnected and it was very just, um it's a dark place.
16:34.43
Lorie Jones
Mm-hmm.
16:37.19
Lisa
And so I encourage everyone to be very careful when you're a woman because I'm pretty passionate about this, this subject.
16:37.91
Lorie Jones
Yeah.
16:41.35
Lorie Jones
Yeah. Yeah.
16:45.48
Lisa
It's a, it's very hard.
16:45.89
Lorie Jones
yeah And it's it's really prevalent. I've seen it, you know, women have talked about it.
16:50.46
Lisa
Yes.
16:52.59
Lorie Jones
We've seen it happen. We watch other women who are dealing with those burnout symptoms and that they, ah you know, you can you can see it coming for them. um So it's something I think that doesn't get enough attention.
17:02.37
Lisa
Yeah.
17:08.08
Lisa
For sure.
17:08.22
Lorie Jones
So I appreciate you sharing that experience.
17:11.63
Lisa
And that's, that's another thing is to to, when you see it, because other people will see it in you much more than you see it in yourself. When you see it, um have that woman back because you got to, got to point it out and start talking about it because it's, it's not something that's easily self recognizable.
17:28.68
Lorie Jones
Yeah.
17:29.37
Lisa
For sure.
17:30.70
Lorie Jones
So, Lisa, what is the worst advice you were ever given? Were you ever given some really bad advice and did you take it? Did you not?
17:42.76
Lisa
Uh, we, again, i keep floating between different answers. I'm old. So I've been in this industry for a long time. So there's so many answers to everything.
17:53.93
Lisa
Um, yeah, many. Okay. So the, I would say if I had to pick one, the absolute worst advice I ever got, uh, I was sitting in my supervisor's office and We were discussing the fact that I was getting a promotion and they were concerned about me because I wanted everybody in the office to like, like each other. And I wanted the environment to be good. And I wanted everyone to get along.
18:31.61
Lisa
Um, and I was told two things. Firstly, employees are tools in a toolbox and When and employee gets dull, throw it out and get a new tool.
18:49.10
Lisa
Don't bother sharpening. That was the first part. And part two was, watch me when i walk around the office. Because people actually shrink in their seats.
19:05.12
Lisa
And a little fear is a good thing.
19:09.93
Lisa
And i will never, ever forget that moment because this was someone who I looked up to sort of, I was just, it was so shocking. And I actually questioned, you know, questioned myself because this was someone who I just was, I was like, oh, this is what we're supposed to do.
19:33.92
Lorie Jones
Yeah, you admired and appreciated.
19:35.94
Lisa
Yeah. And, uh, it, would and I think about it actually pretty often.
19:36.80
Lorie Jones
Uh-huh.
19:41.70
Lisa
Um, it was, it was so shocking and it changed on a dime the minute that I heard it, um, as to how I do not want anyone who ever works for me to feel.
19:55.52
Lorie Jones
Mm-hmm.
19:56.89
Lisa
Yeah.
19:57.07
Lorie Jones
How young were you?
20:00.52
Lisa
It wasn't when I was 20.
20:02.42
Lorie Jones
Yeah. Yeah. So, so you, you could, did you stay with that company very much longer after that point?
20:04.80
Lisa
yeah
20:12.32
Lisa
No.
20:13.23
Lorie Jones
Yeah. I, I, I think that that would, like, I'm so passionate about growing a team and,
20:14.41
Lisa
Yeah.
20:19.08
Lisa
You are. Culture, that's your thing.
20:21.06
Lorie Jones
Yeah.
20:21.32
Lisa
We have that in common too. It's because we read books. ah
20:25.82
Lorie Jones
Yeah.
20:28.44
Lisa
um Yeah. it You know, ah i think that are it it actually made me, I'm appreciative of that moment because I think it made me such a better leader.
20:40.60
Lisa
because I was so clear about what I did not want.
20:40.52
Lorie Jones
who
20:44.72
Lorie Jones
Yeah.
20:44.83
Lisa
And so the opposite of that, ah servant leadership is so huge to me and a culture that is just continually worked on. And I've been so lucky because, well, I've made a very specific decision to to to put boundaries around what kinds of cultures I will accept.
21:06.81
Lorie Jones
Yeah.
21:07.02
Lisa
So, yeah.
21:07.91
Lorie Jones
Yeah. And, and, and that does take a little bit of maturity, but I think it also just, you know, like you can feel sometimes inside of yourself, like what sounds right and what sounds wrong based on your values.
21:21.76
Lisa
Yeah.
21:23.18
Lorie Jones
And so there are probably other people that that advice would be just fine for it. They do treat, you know, like they're all about efficiency and not really,
21:34.36
Lorie Jones
ah You know, they're not really into that idea of culture and empowerment and growing and helping other humans in that way. So so I think that when you're feeling that disconnect between what your values are telling you is right and what someone, even somebody you admire, you have to really question that.
21:43.66
Lisa
yeah
21:52.91
Lisa
Yeah. It was painful. You know, it it was actually like hurtful because I was, it was, it was just such a blow to, you know, someone that I just really admired so much. Um, but you're right. It's when you hear it, you get that gut.
22:08.39
Lisa
Oof, this is not, this is not right. Like you just feel it. And yeah, it really defined, defined me ah I'm always working on being a better leader. I don't think it's, you know, a destination. It's just endless.
22:23.91
Lorie Jones
Yeah.
22:24.29
Lisa
But it definitely shaped me for sure.
22:26.66
Lorie Jones
Yeah. So what about... um A situation that you can think of along your journey that maybe you wish you could go back and do differently. And I'm not going to say regrets exactly, but just like, you know, something that if you have the knowledge you have now, you would have just changed the way you dealt with that.
22:47.81
Lisa
Let me go through the index of all the things I have done wrong. There's so many, so many.
22:51.09
Lorie Jones
I know why.
22:53.50
Lisa
Let's see.
22:55.32
Lorie Jones
I know I could make a whole book out of that. That would be a whole book we could read things that Laurie did wrong.
22:59.37
Lisa
That would be another podcast.
23:00.93
Lorie Jones
Yeah.
23:01.29
Lisa
Like all the things we did wrong. Um, this is a similar situation.
23:14.74
Lorie Jones
Yeah.
23:16.94
Lisa
So, I had someone on my team who was ah really young woman. She had just graduated from college. And when I want to say just, I think we were the first place she worked.
23:31.59
Lorie Jones
Mm-hmm.
23:32.46
Lisa
And she was excellent. I adored her and she was excellent. And I was so excited about her being there, um partially because she had great skills. But more than that, it was like,
23:49.01
Lisa
I love the freshness that she brought to the office. I love the perspective she brought to the office. I love the energy she brought the love everything about her. And I remember we were at a conference once and um i was trying to take her around to introduce her. were at a women's cocktail hour.
24:08.43
Lisa
So the attendees at the conference who were women went to this cocktail hour. She could network with the other woman who were at the event. And i was taking her around introducing her to everyone. because I wanted her to, you know, get in the industry and meet people. And I introduced her once and I don't even remember this.
24:26.99
Lisa
I only know because she told me after. When I introduced her, i said, this is Danielle, her true name, because hey, Danielle, if you're out there, this is Danielle.
24:35.26
Lorie Jones
Yeah.
24:36.67
Lisa
She's like a mini me. And I don't remember introducing her like that, but my intent when I said it was, I see myself in her when I just got out of school and I'm like, I love her, you know, her enthusiasm and her drive.
24:49.89
Lorie Jones
Yeah.
24:57.18
Lisa
And, you know, it was i would look at her and be like, that was me when I was 20, you know, I had so much freshness and, you know, but to her credit, cause she's a rock star.
24:58.23
Lorie Jones
yeah
25:01.99
Lorie Jones
yeah
25:09.34
Lisa
She came to me after the event and she said, you know what, can you not introduce me like that? Like, I don't want to be a mini you. I want to be me. And I was like, first of all, go girl.
25:20.24
Lisa
Like she's like 23.
25:20.70
Lorie Jones
Yeah. Yeah.
25:23.84
Lisa
i was like, good for you. And I was like, just so you know, I'm that didn't come out how I meant it. If, if I said it like that, which I didn't remember, that is not at all what I meant.
25:36.17
Lisa
Like that sounds condescending and weird.
25:36.37
Lorie Jones
Yeah.
25:37.81
Lisa
I don't know why I said it that way, but here's what I really meant. It was like what I see in you.
25:42.34
Lorie Jones
yeah
25:43.10
Lisa
i
25:43.52
Lorie Jones
yeah
25:43.90
Lisa
you know, um, But it made me more careful because i adore bringing women into our industry, um mentoring and coaching and doing all that stuff.
25:47.97
Lorie Jones
yeah
25:55.96
Lisa
And the words we use are really important. And very often I feel like ah women, especially young women in our industry are, there's a little bit of condescension sometimes.
25:59.23
Lorie Jones
Oh, yeah.
26:06.64
Lisa
So I'll take that I did it and I didn't mean it, but I'm very careful with my words now because words matter.
26:14.25
Lorie Jones
Yeah, that's... They do. And it's... I think it's really... important that she came back to you and said, Hey, yeah, that's huge.
26:22.22
Lisa
Right? I never would have done that when I was 20.
26:27.39
Lorie Jones
Yeah.
26:27.48
Lisa
Go Danielle.
26:27.47
Lorie Jones
I mean,
26:28.04
Lisa
I still chat with her. We're still buddies. So you're still awesome, Danielle.
26:32.68
Lorie Jones
I know. And, and I do, i have ah you know, a younger team member that I like want to support and grow like that. And I think that it is important that I went to four one k meetings and I would um say, you know, someone as young as her,
26:52.08
Lorie Jones
is which should be in this sort of investment and someone as old as me should be in this sort of investment. And, and it just, it, I stopped doing that too, because it didn't sound right to just call out her youth or something like that.
27:04.41
Lorie Jones
So, so I see that, I see that there are things that we just have to be so careful at especially in this industry, because you don't want to ever give the perception that you are not a hundred percent behind and supportive and want these young women to grow.
27:11.80
Lisa
Yeah.
27:22.04
Lisa
Right. Exactly.
27:23.04
Lorie Jones
no
27:23.46
Lisa
Yeah. I mean, we are people who are, you know, kind of crazed about supporting women. That's why it really bothered me and stuck with me. i was like, I cannot believe I said it like that. What was I thinking?
27:33.82
Lisa
And I mean, I know what I was thinking, but it, yeah, it's just, ah yeah.
27:34.35
Lorie Jones
Yeah.
27:36.87
Lorie Jones
Yeah. Yeah.
27:39.20
Lisa
So we'll all be careful about how we talk to young women are in our industry, men and women, how we talk to women, young women in our industry.
27:47.80
Lorie Jones
yeah What is, if you could go back and talk to yourself at a younger age, 20, 21, 19, somewhere around there, what would you tell her?
28:01.09
Lisa
I would tell her, this is simple. I would, I would just be like, girl, chill out. Just chill out. I, I,
28:12.05
Lisa
it's enough with the perfectionism. That's what I would, that's what easy, simple message to myself that I still try to tell myself today. It's that perfectionist kind of thing where you feel like you have to do it 10 times as good as somebody else.
28:29.27
Lisa
And you know, somebody asks you for one thing and you feel like you have to give 10 and you know, i fall into that, which is how I fell into burnout. So, um,
28:39.95
Lorie Jones
Mm-hmm.
28:41.36
Lisa
Uh, it's something I'm really careful of when I'm monitoring myself, but yeah, if I could, I don't know if I probably wouldn't have listened to myself at 20, even if I told myself, I'd be like, sure. Cause that's what I do now. I I'm aware of it. I'm much more aware of it. So I would, I would tell myself, be aware of this because it's very draining to just the constant perfectionism is, um, is exhausting and no one needs it to be that perfect. No one cares if it's that perfect.
29:11.69
Lorie Jones
Yeah.
29:11.84
Lisa
You know, like I learned from my last boss that like about 80% is good enough.
29:11.83
Lorie Jones
Except for.
29:17.87
Lisa
The extra 20 is going to cost you all that time and no one's going to care. So I'm working on it.
29:20.89
Lorie Jones
Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. The 80-20 rule. And I do think that like you can get inside your own head, like you care, but that extra 20% takes an extra, you know, 80% worth of effort.
29:34.08
Lorie Jones
And it just really in the, in the scheme of things, it doesn't matter.
29:36.70
Lisa
Yep.
29:39.73
Lorie Jones
Yeah.
29:40.36
Lisa
It's a struggle though.
29:40.35
Lorie Jones
That perfectionism.
29:41.04
Lisa
If you've got that, oh, it is a struggle. I was, editing I was editing ah video last night and I couldn't get the last half a second edited out. And I lost my mind. And about an hour later, I was like, oh my gosh, no one is going to see that half a second.
29:57.68
Lisa
This is what I'm talking about. Like just chill, chill out. It's going to be okay.
30:02.11
Lorie Jones
ah I think we probably would all go back and tell Ursula.
30:02.74
Lisa
Yeah.
30:05.06
Lorie Jones
I know I would. I would tell myself that, too. i probably wouldn't listen either. but
30:09.11
Lisa
Oh, and travel, travel, travel, travel. travel When you're, so this is what I tell like my kids now who are in their twenties, um, travel because it really, truly changes how you think and how you perceive things. When you leave the United States, oh my gosh, your brain just explodes and in so many good ways.
30:30.74
Lisa
And, um, you can only do it like at certain times or it's easier at certain times. And when you are in your twenties, man, Before it all starts, just go.
30:41.29
Lorie Jones
Yeah.
30:42.16
Lisa
Yeah. Peanut
30:42.27
Lorie Jones
You might eat peanut butter and jelly for a while, but it's all right. It's all good.
30:46.14
Lisa
butter and jelly is a rock star dinner, in my opinion.
30:48.59
Lorie Jones
I know.
30:51.03
Lorie Jones
Amen. Especially if it's in Costa Rica or Nicaragua, right? yeah
30:55.13
Lisa
Right?
30:56.72
Lorie Jones
Actually, I don't think they have peanut butter down in Costa Rica. My daughter went with there to teach English, and and I think they don't they don't have the traditional peanut butter because that was one of the things on her list of things. Mom, can you bring me?
31:10.03
Lorie Jones
Right?
31:11.05
Lisa
Really? That's fascinating.
31:12.16
Lorie Jones
Yeah.
31:13.09
Lisa
Huh.
31:13.31
Lorie Jones
Yeah.
31:14.23
Lisa
Costa Rica is on my list.
31:14.15
Lorie Jones
So, yeah, it's beautiful, but adventurous. Very adventurous. 20-year-olds do it, 100%. Yeah.
31:24.46
Lisa
Yeah.
31:24.60
Lorie Jones
So what, what scared you the most when you started on your journey? Was there anything that was like super scary and does it still scare you or did you figure out a way to deal with it?
31:35.14
Lisa
I mean, to me, I never thought I would stay in finance just because finance was scary. I was an English major, remember?
31:41.29
Lorie Jones
Yeah, yeah.
31:43.24
Lisa
anyone told me you're going to spend your career working in finance, I would have said, you're talking about the wrong person. I thought, you know, I would wind up in the academia or something, you know, um numbers, not my thing.
31:49.70
Lorie Jones
Yeah.
31:59.30
Lisa
I'm very careful at like, literally I'm terrible at numbers. I have to, I tell people if we're working on a project, I just take the numbers part and I'm like, you do that. i'm getting a little bit better, but, um, o yeah, I'd never, i found finance just overwhelming and terrifying and and distasteful. I was like, you know, I didn't even like anything about the industry until I got into it.
32:20.99
Lisa
Um, just from, you know, the outside specifically, most definitely,
32:23.76
Lorie Jones
Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm.
32:28.53
Lisa
The thing that scared me the most in the industry when I was young was going up and talking to people that I admired or I thought were really cool or like were big people in the industry. you know um If I was at events or you know going out on calls or whatever it was, i would have this just not in my stomach and I'd be like, I really wanna go talk to her.
32:52.44
Lisa
She's so cool. And I wouldn't do it. I was terrified. It took me a long time, actually, to get to where I am now, where I'll go up and like talk to anybody. Because it's, it's once you do it enough, you realize like, oh, these are all just people.
33:07.54
Lisa
They're all just, I mean, it sounds a little silly, but the more you do it, you're like, there's nothing in particular that's
33:07.56
Lorie Jones
Yeah. Yeah.
33:14.99
Lisa
you know, different about this person. They're they're just a person.
33:20.04
Lorie Jones
yeah
33:20.79
Lisa
So i'm not I'm not at all afraid of it now, but that did come with experience for sure. and it was very, very tough at the beginning. But again, i feel like as women, like let's help the other women in our industry along with that, you know, like get get them in front of women, get them used to talking to other people in the industry who are
33:35.99
Lorie Jones
yeah
33:43.75
Lisa
who are like the big timers, you know?
33:45.69
Lorie Jones
Yeah, that's, and I think that's something that comes out in, I know you're a member of WIPN and you've got that research.
33:51.24
Lisa
Yes.
33:52.78
Lorie Jones
And I think that's something that comes out in the research is that, is that there's, you know, there's, ah people need mentors. These young ladies need mentors.
34:03.48
Lorie Jones
want Someone that's going to help and share their network and, and help them to get a little bit further ahead or help them to grow.
34:06.64
Lisa
Yeah.
34:10.76
Lorie Jones
And I know that you're a big proponent of that. I am as well. I think that I think that sometimes I'll tell myself all they can tell me is no. And, and, you know, you, you, you have the courage to go introduce yourself, but maybe if you don't like find another lady there, who's like, you know, I really want to know this person.
34:27.24
Lisa
right
34:28.06
Lorie Jones
Do you know this person? Can you help, you know, some, we're, we're pretty good about sharing and helping.
34:36.08
Lisa
I think so. Yeah. Whippin is, we just built out a whole, if anybody's notes, we inspire promote network, whippin.org. I've been on the board for few years now, and it's all about empowering women in the, getting women interested in the industry and then empowering women in the industry.
34:53.31
Lisa
But we just built out a very, very robust mentoring and executive coaching program. And we spent 18 months building it specifically for this reason. So big proponent of getting women in front of.
35:06.87
Lorie Jones
Yeah. And if anyone else is listening that like wants to use your framework of building out that mentoring program, I think it would really go well in other professions as well.
35:18.58
Lorie Jones
You know, aerospace, anything like that, the the problems that young women have.
35:19.06
Lisa
Oh, for sure.
35:22.23
Lisa
Yeah, it's not specific at all to the finance industry. And in fact, when we built it, the research we did was um on on the ah components of it. The research we did was in the industry looking at programs, but also outside the industry.
35:32.12
Lorie Jones
Yeah.
35:36.65
Lisa
So it's um it's a mix of programs from both.
35:39.14
Lorie Jones
yeah and i I think it's really great. And i it would be it would be really neat to see that go into some maybe some of the other um industries that they want to set up this mentor-mentee relationship so that we can help young ladies grow in their profession.
35:50.12
Lisa
Mm-hmm.
35:53.97
Lisa
Right.
35:57.29
Lorie Jones
It's good for everybody. It's good for the profession. It's good for the young women. It's good for the mentors. It's just good all the way around.
36:01.60
Lisa
Yep. And I'm happy to share the framework because it's, you know, it's nothing that's proprietary or we spent a lot of time building it.
36:14.19
Lisa
We're really, really proud of it. I would love for people to copy it. Copy away. Contact me and I'll give it to you.
36:19.06
Lorie Jones
Yeah. Yeah. What about, um, any unique challenges you faced during your journey because you were a woman?
36:31.02
Lisa
The fact we're asking this to women in finance is just...
36:34.51
Lorie Jones
I know.
36:36.38
Lisa
ah Yeah, all of those. And what specifically? um i Okay, so I am going to repeat what Marla Silver said on your podcast.
36:48.74
Lorie Jones
Hmm.
36:50.48
Lisa
I had a moment with a superior who told me... i believe that what she was told was... that she was ah too aggressive, if I remember correctly.
37:01.71
Lorie Jones
Mm-hmm.
37:03.69
Lisa
And what I was told was very similar, but it was, when we're in meetings, I need you to watch your tone and tone it down. And again, something that has stayed with me since that day, and that was a long time ago, um and that I think about often, and I would say that that was one of the most traumatic moments of my career, which sounds crazy.
37:33.20
Lisa
But when you think you're doing this great job and you're going in and you're just, you know, trying to get work done and you're, you know, being professional and you're like at the table, you've got a seat at the table, you've, you know, reached the C-suite and you're doing your thing.
37:38.84
Lorie Jones
Mm-hmm.
37:45.65
Lisa
And then to be told, watch your tone. The, the, um, it was traumatic. It really was. And, ah it's crazy.
37:57.51
Lisa
of course. And as she said, things like that are not acceptable to say in our industry. Hopefully it's it's getting a little bit less, I hope.
38:10.59
Lisa
But from what I hear, when someone tells that story, there's 10 other women saying, yeah, that's exactly what I've been told. um
38:19.05
Lorie Jones
Good
38:20.25
Lisa
And, you know, it's just, ah it's it's unfortunate and Can't really figure out where it comes from. And have to say about that experience, the only thing I was really happy about was that I looked across the table and said, that is really sexist.
38:40.00
Lisa
And I don't think you would have said that to a man.
38:45.50
Lisa
And I walked away like, good for you.
38:45.64
Lorie Jones
ah john
38:48.89
Lisa
So ah I guess that teaches, you know, we got to call it out when it happens, you know, until it stops happening.
38:54.63
Lorie Jones
that's yeah that's a good idea you know that that that we're not just doing it a lot of times for ourselves but for those others that maybe are quieter like that won't call it out and and that that idea of being like what is too aggressive anyway what you know
39:10.31
Lisa
Right.
39:20.00
Lisa
you know, again, like I try to, you know, when those things happen and it happens so often and you hear it so often, and you know, I don't know about you, but I'm constantly on all these, I'm not rolling my eyes that the fact that exists, I'm rolling my eyes. The fact that have to exist is, you know, just happened last week. I was chatting on LinkedIn with another woman in the industry who's going through some issues with this kind of stuff with, you know, just sexism and ridiculousness and all of it happens in this, you know, the in texts and chats, like behind LinkedIn, behind X, behind, and, you know, groups, um group texts between women who are talking to each other. And I'm, yeah, I know, um, I understand why women don't call it out when they're younger, because it it feels like a luxury to be able to call it out.
40:08.39
Lorie Jones
Yeah.
40:08.96
Lisa
Because the ah clapback is pretty real. and
40:12.22
Lorie Jones
Yeah.
40:14.74
Lisa
But I'm not there.
40:16.41
Lorie Jones
Yeah.
40:18.59
Lisa
So, yeah.
40:18.73
Lorie Jones
yeah
40:19.15
Lisa
So it's, again, like as women, we have to we have to call it out when we see it. men obviously have to call it out. But women, we have to call it out for our for our younger um folks in the industry who can.
40:31.22
Lorie Jones
yeah more
40:32.24
Lisa
Legitimately can't. I agree with them. it It would be really a difficult thing for them to do.
40:36.84
Lorie Jones
yeah Yeah, it is.
40:37.79
Lisa
Yeah.
40:41.06
Lorie Jones
Lisa, what is the thing you are the most proud of?
40:47.14
Lisa
Every,
40:52.84
Lisa
I would say, my daughter, for sure. I want to say my kids, because I'm proud of all my kids. I've got three kids. I've got two boys and a daughter.
41:06.91
Lisa
um My daughter's the oldest, and I've two younger sons. proud of all of them. They're all doing great. I've raised pretty darn good humans, pretty excited about that, like all flourishing out there.
41:20.17
Lisa
But my daughter was born with an illness and she has an autoimmune disease and it has, i feel like it's been me and her kind of against the world.
41:32.52
Lorie Jones
Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm.
41:33.67
Lisa
And it's a really difficult disease. And, um, it's one of the ones that flares and goes you know in and out. It's chronic. It's incurable.
41:45.66
Lisa
But she and I kind of have this thing where it was not going to stop her. So she's she has more tenacity than anyone i have ever known in my life. And I remember just being blown away when she was a kid um because it comes with an awful lot of pain.
42:03.35
Lorie Jones
Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm.
42:03.59
Lisa
And just being blown away at her ability to take that much Um, and, and just keep being resilient, you know? So I feel like she's taught me so much.
42:17.81
Lisa
Um, but also she and i have, since she was, you know, in grade school, she was diagnosed when she was nine. Um, we have had this thing where it was just like, okay, we have to get her an education.
42:33.24
Lisa
Education has always been incredibly important to my family. When you have a child who's sick, public education is even private education. It does not work.
42:42.74
Lorie Jones
Yeah, I can imagine.
42:43.39
Lisa
um
42:43.90
Lorie Jones
Mm-hmm.
42:44.45
Lisa
It is when your child is in the hospital for most of the time, um you know, we were lucky enough to be able to afford things like occasional tutors or, you know, and also lucky enough that both of us were educated.
43:00.17
Lisa
And so um I homeschooled that kid while working full time.
43:06.56
Lorie Jones
Yeah.
43:06.81
Lisa
And it was me and her with this goal.
43:06.91
Lorie Jones
Yeah.
43:09.35
Lisa
We're going to graduate from college. Like, we're going to do it. I will never forget, she she gets terrible bone pain. And she was laying in a bathtub. She was, I think, in middle school, maybe early high school, trying to relieve the pain in her joints while she and I did math, math, which I can't.
43:30.95
Lisa
So I had to, like, learn the math before I taught her the math. And it was so traumatic for me.
43:34.06
Lorie Jones
yeah
43:35.59
Lisa
But I was doing math on the bathroom mirror with like dry erase markers while she, and that moment will stick with me as like, look what we did. You know, she graduated from high school. She graduated from college.
43:49.68
Lisa
Now it took her seven years to graduate, seven and a half years to graduate from college, but she did it. She's now out in the workforce. She's a social worker. She's helping other people. Like I, it I burst with joy over that kid.
44:05.09
Lorie Jones
Yeah.
44:05.76
Lisa
I do.
44:07.23
Lorie Jones
I can imagine. I bet you cried when she graduated. Yeah.
44:10.42
Lisa
Oh, I would cry now if, yeah.
44:14.66
Lorie Jones
Yeah.
44:15.97
Lisa
I mean, she just had her second baby. She's got an 18 months old. She just had her second baby.
44:20.27
Lorie Jones
Oh.
44:21.96
Lisa
So now I have two little grandbabies. She's got this little family and I'm like, and she still struggles. Right. But gosh, like she and I just had this thing and we just did it.
44:27.34
Lorie Jones
Yeah.
44:31.00
Lisa
And I probably will never be as proud of anything my whole life.
44:35.45
Lorie Jones
Yeah.
44:35.99
Lisa
Yeah.
44:36.34
Lorie Jones
so What an example for all of us.
44:39.37
Lisa
Yeah.
44:42.01
Lisa
Not me.
44:42.11
Lorie Jones
Well, Lisa.
44:42.49
Lisa
I'm talking about her.
44:43.86
Lorie Jones
yeah I know. Well, you know, mom has a little bit to do with that too.
44:48.46
Lisa
that
44:48.51
Lorie Jones
The fact that you were learning math to teach her.
44:51.97
Lisa
I did successfully learn, the relearn high school math, which was new math, by the way.
44:51.99
Lorie Jones
Well,
44:57.24
Lorie Jones
yeah, that's kind of feat. I'm telling you the way they teach math nowadays.
45:00.52
Lisa
It was a few.
45:02.24
Lorie Jones
I'm like, Oh, good heavens. Yeah.
45:03.85
Lisa
the whole new world with math.
45:05.34
Lorie Jones
yeah
45:05.87
Lisa
All
45:07.61
Lorie Jones
So, Lisa, any advice for a young lady who's just starting down on this journey that you're so successful at? Anything that you would tell her?
45:22.70
Lisa
all right, I'm going to echo another one of your guests, Ivana Polonio. I love Ivana.
45:29.12
Lorie Jones
ah yeah.
45:29.58
Lisa
She and I are dear friends. um And I'm going to echo what she said. I can't recall specifically what she said, but I know it's very similar. So one of the things I've really tried to do is life goes so fast, right? And we're just like working and we're trying to like, if we if we have kids, we're taking care kids and we're trying to volunteer and we're trying to, you know, do all these things and everything is so fast.
45:57.60
Lisa
One of the things that I'm really trying to do now, and I really wish I started doing when I was very young, like in my, just out of college, was every experience that I had that impacted me. And I'm talking little things all day long, right?
46:13.39
Lisa
You meet this person and you're like, oh, I love her. want to be like her.
46:16.19
Lorie Jones
Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm.
46:17.49
Lisa
Or you meet someone and you're like, oh, I do not want to be that. Or somebody does something for you and you're like, wow, that was, that really impacted me this way.
46:28.15
Lisa
Or you read something like whatever it is. We have these things all day long that impact us. Evaluate why that elicited that response in you.
46:40.19
Lisa
And what that will do is it'll teach you who you are, right? Like what brings you joy?
46:45.15
Lorie Jones
and
46:48.08
Lisa
What makes you sad? Because knowing yourself
46:51.23
Lorie Jones
um
46:53.32
Lisa
it's, it's, it's a process, right? Especially when feel like when you're out of school, and you're out of that, like artificial college life, you kind of get dropped onto the planet. And then you're like, you know, you remember that?
47:06.86
Lisa
Who am I?
47:08.05
Lorie Jones
Yeah. Oh, yeah.
47:09.56
Lisa
Yeah, you just feel like, you know, imposter syndrome, big time.
47:13.09
Lorie Jones
Yeah.
47:15.73
Lisa
And I very much think that if you can get to know so much about yourself, if you just
47:15.79
Lorie Jones
Yeah.
47:21.50
Lisa
think Anytime you have like visceral reactions to things, be like, why do I love that?
47:25.97
Lorie Jones
Yeah.
47:26.09
Lisa
You know, i have a ah colleague who I admire so much because he is the best listener i have ever known.
47:26.18
Lorie Jones
huh
47:35.25
Lisa
And he will remember things about conversations with people. And anytime he does that, I'm always amazed. Right.
47:43.77
Lorie Jones
yeah
47:44.81
Lisa
He'll go meet 40 people and he'll be like, oh, you know I saw was Jack. Remember his wife was the one who had cancer, but she beat it. Like he knows all these things. And i will be amazed and be like, how does he do that?
47:59.03
Lisa
And then I think to myself, like, that's what you want. Be a better listener, you know? And so it shapes who you are, who you want to be.
48:03.95
Lorie Jones
Yeah. Mm-hmm.
48:07.95
Lisa
That is super helpful in your career because you will get to points that are forks. Do I go this way?
48:13.87
Lorie Jones
hu
48:14.32
Lisa
Do I go that way? If you always follow who you are, i don't think you can make terrible, terrible mistakes.
48:23.76
Lorie Jones
That's a really good thought process too. And maybe write it down, like, like write down what it is you admire and why that speaks to you. Because i all know that, that I have those people that come into my life where I'm like, oh, I want to do just that thing.
48:39.53
Lorie Jones
But then, you know, life happens and 20 seconds later, where I'm like, oh, shiny, you know?
48:41.59
Lisa
Yep.
48:44.38
Lorie Jones
Yeah.
48:44.78
Lisa
Yeah.
48:46.29
Lorie Jones
So, so write it down. I love that.
48:48.63
Lisa
Write it down.
48:48.66
Lorie Jones
That is a really good thought process and a way to, to when you are at those forks in your road or those decision points to go back and say, well, who do I want to be?
49:01.12
Lorie Jones
Who did I most admire? And where, which situation is going to get me around more of those qualities or those people that i that I want to be.
49:09.67
Lisa
Right. Yeah.
49:11.76
Lorie Jones
Well, thank you so much, Lisa, for your time today and for sharing your journey and sharing your story. I've really enjoyed our conversation.
49:19.45
Lisa
Always, it's always fun to talk to you.
49:19.66
Lorie Jones
if If I have ah a listener who wants to get in touch with you, pick your brain, ask a question. How does she do that?
49:30.27
Lisa
LinkedIn is great. And you can email me. It's Lisa at financial transitionist.com. That's a mouthful. So maybe try the LinkedIn.
49:43.19
Lorie Jones
Yeah, for sure. So, well, thank you so much. Thanks for sharing all your thoughts and I really appreciate it.
49:47.25
Lisa
Thanks, Lori.
49:50.58
Lisa
Good to talk to you.